Joining the military

I am 18 and a half and starting to think about enlisting. I am starting to look into the different branches and want to work in something that will help me with future jobs in the areas I like.
I want to be a gunsmith in the long run and I love tactical firearms and long range shooting. I have read and researched military life, history, tactics, and weapons since I was 8 years old and think
it would be a great life experience and I want to carry on my family's history of service.

So knowing there are dogs here that have served and there are some who are active duty what's your thoughts and experience.

Sounds like you should be an armeror. They fix and modify guns of all shapes and sizes. Or, you can be a grunt and work your way to a weapons expert. They are more experts on the operations/use of weapons but certainly know how to work on a firearm as well.

I have a unique job (not here at recruiting commands) and I have worked closely with just about every job field in all the services. Not all specialties but I have knowledge of all the general fields. So, feel free to call me and pick my brain or email if you are more comfortable with that or we can just talk here. Cell: 801 209 4338 Christopher.peace@marines.usmc.mil (just don't call me Chris, that name is reserved for family. I am Warren.

As for which service... You know my answer. But, I have lived on Arm, Air Force, Navy and Marine bases, so I can tell you about the differences in life styles to.

Thanks JJ! I was hoping you would check in here

Go into a Military Career Center when you have some time. They usually house all four branches with the Coast guard thrown in at some. Visit each branch and talk with a recruiter at each. Tell them about what you want out of life and they will tell you how they can help you reach that goal. I assure you that is how they will guide the conversation anyway, each service in it's own special way.

I highly recommend visiting at the beginning of a month. When the end of a month draws near, recruiters are desperate to make "mission." they use that term to avoid using the word quota. They have a quota! Near the end of the month some less than honest recruiters will say anything to get your John Hancock to avoid the butt chewing, or worse if they failed to make mission before, from their command.

Don't let that scare you. The majority of recruiters I talk with are honest men. However, if they do tell you something that sounds too good to be true, run it by me and I'll give you the real deal.

Thanks. My dad will probably be with me and he served. So that will work for me since he still looks like he is in.

Take a look at this http://usmilitary.about.com/od/enlistedjo2/a/21.htm

You can also find info on other jobs in all services on that site. I highly recommend that site for you research.

Thanks for the info. It looks like a good site.

I enjoyed my time in the Army. It wasn't the best thing I ever did. But it put me on the path to get where I am today which is. I don't know that I would be where I am without the time, effort, training and disciplne that I developed during that time of my life.

JJ gave some good advice; this is a decision that should not be made hastily. I would suggest you talk with him. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Thanks guys. It's great to have a sounding board while I think about this.

I am biased as well, but think JJ has put you on the right track. As far as the services go I personally think the AF treats you better as far as housing/chow halls etc (JJ, please correct me If I am wrong,)I've been out going on 18 years now and things could have changed A LOT. As far as armorers are concerned, I THINK the Air Force only has SAMTU (Small Arms Training Unit) that are the true armorers, but that as I said may have changed.

By all means, do like JJ said and check out each branch, telling them what you want to do and see what they have available. And YES, each branch will "Hype" their own as the best. DECIDE FOR YOURSELF which one offers you the best opportunity to do what you want, and the old saying "IF IT SOUNDS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE, IT PROBABLY IS" also applies to the Military.

Good luck.

Thanks skunk.

im a 1st Lieutenant in the active duty US Army. commissioned out of ROTC and can tell you - being an officer is the way to go.

the army is best for what you want, according to your post. you can be a small arms repair mechanic. i have a few of them in my company and they are experts @ E-4/E-5. they know their stuff and have a HUGE impact on a battalion level firing mission (field artillery). the military is a great career and is something that offers you a retirement that NO other entity on earth can. 20 yrs and retirement pension starts the following month after your 20th year. im at 3 years time now and will be pinning Captain here next year when we get home. i have been here almost 12 months in RC East Afghanistan. Good luck and keep us all posted.


LT Tucker

Thanks. I am interested in small arms. From 50 bmg down. I have no interest in field artillery. There is not many civilian jobs that field artillery will carry over to.

Not trying to belittle Clark's post, but I thought it wasn't what you wanted. When/if you talk to recruiters, SPECIFY you are talking about HAND HELD ARMS, go ahead and say 50 cal on down. Anything larger than that MIGHT get you in artillery. Also ask if they have GUARANTEED jobs in the field you are interested in. If they don't you might want to go ahead and take your chances with that branch of the service or move on to another branch. DO YOUR RESEARCH!!!

My dad said to get a contract the specifies exactly what I want to do. That way I would have a better shot at going into a field that I want. I will have to ask JJ about it. My dad had a contract for the job he chose in the airforce.

Just remember that if you fail in any way your in breach of contract, and they don't have to honor what they put in writing. This isn't a knock on the military - its the same in civilian life.

When I was involved with Marine OCS I made sure to document everything thoroughly.

Oh, and I second Clark's statement:

Do not enlist. Go to college, and then enter service as an officer.

My father was in the Marine Corp from 68-74 and Army from 76-84.

My step-father was in the Army from 67-99 (when he died).

Money for college is tight and I will not go into debt. So a lone is not a option. Also I really can't find a college that has a program that envolves small arms building and repair. I have interviewed at the Pennsylvania school of gunsmithing and have been accepted. It is one of the
Best schools in the world but again money is a problem. A army recruiter told my dad that the army might pay for me to go as part of my job In the field I want to work in.

GD, that is a possibility if you go the officer route, depending on what the particular branch of the service you choose needs. It is an option worth looking into. They MIGHT pay for your schooling. Write down what you want to do. Write down your options (how to pay or get someone to pay for your schooling). Talk to the recruiters and then write down what they will pay for (schooling).

Yep. I really will be praying about this. I don't want to step out of Gods will for my life. All the Christians here can understand why it's so important to me.

I really appreciate all the interest and advise from my fellow dogs. I didn't think this thread would get many posts. But you really care. And for that thank you guys.

It sounds like you've made up your mind to enlist. Bear in mind, if your plans do not align with the military's plans for you - you're going to end up doing something else and will be out the number of years you enlist for afterwards. That's time you can't make up.

My brother-in-law is getting out of the Army this month, and wishes he'd finished college instead of enlisting. He chose to quit school, and enlist because my sister has FIVE children and money was very tight. Now my brother-in-law is getting out of the military with no discernible skills. He'll also have to compete for a job in this economy.

I only say this because my father was military, my step mother was military, my step father was military. The three of those parents had 56 years of combined service - AND EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM SAID I WAS PROHIBITED FROM ENLISTING.

I'd recommend you soul search about the reality related to making a career out of gunsmithing after 3-6 years in the military.

I'm a certifiable gun nut, and wanted to do something related to guns because they're my passion. However, I decided to go to college and work in a career that could allow me to buy guns at will. This isn't a knock on your dreams, but is coming from a guy that had similar interests / considerations 20 years ago and is very happy with his decision.

It will take you longer, but you can work your way thorough college. Frankly, without a college degree your prospects for a "bright financial future" are bleak.

I also thought about a job with Colt, LMT, LWRC, Remington Defence, or a similar company. But almost all want some form of military experience. It seems really hard to get any info about working for one of these companies.

I do understand where your coming from though.

GD, Keep your eyes open, listen to what everyone has to say, weight your options and RESEARCH RESEARCH RESEARCH AND GET IT IN WRITING! Oh and BEWARE. I enlisted as a weapons mechanic. What they DIDN'T say was that it was made up of three different sections. Bomb loader, weapons release (making sure it will fall or fire off the aircraft) and bomb dump (building up the bombs an storing them. If you got into the section you wanted, they can "Draft" you into another section that is short manned. That's what happened to me. Oh well the best thing was my knees going south and cross training, but then again there my options were limited. All in all though it worked out for me.

BOTTOM line, no matter what ANYONE tells you, it is YOUR choice. If you don't choose the right one, it is on you, and no one else. You need to be willing to accept that.

Good Luck in what ever you choose, what ever branch you choose and keep your eyes open.

Again thanks skunk

No problem, I hope that I have helped some. It's a shame (If you go the Marine route) that you're not out west. You could have JJ to help you out if you were in his AO.

It's a lot to think about and I am not 100% set on the military yet. But I think JJ will be able to answer some of my questions.

Skunk is a very wise man, and I agree with his assessments:

1) RESEARCH!
2) Understand that the you'll be entering the military as the lowest denominator - and they will do what they want to do with you.
3) Pray about it.
4) ITS YOUR DECISION.

I can add that from my experience, people who enlisted end up doing something completely unrelated to their dreams. I'm friends with several retired Marine and Naval officers, and they've all adjusted to civilian life well. They're working in fields related to their military career and doing very well financially.

Your interests, prospects, experience and vaules are all very different from anyone else's. I would say, however, that you should really weigh the information you hear and research. You're likely to hear the military is great from someone who really likes it, and likely to hear it sucks from someone who hates it. However, you have a specific career path in mind and short of ending up a MOS 18B - its my opinion that you're not going to get where you want to go through enlistment.

This is my last thought on this....

Gunsmithing is a trade - not a profession. As such, its a "hands on" job that requires direct training and experience to succeed. I could teach you how to build an AR15 / M16 / M4 in about 1 hour. In two days you'll be able to do this automatically.

Gunsmithing for a living is going involve a lot more than working on AR15's and M9's so is this really going to "prepare" you for your desired career?

If you're interested in the more technical aspects of weapons then you'll need to pursue a career in physics and engineering - both of which require a college education.

GD - Don't forget about the GI Bill! You could enlist and STILL go to college while you're in. I don't remember the specifics but I believe the Government will reimburse you with the GI Bill. You could also join the Coast Guard so you wouldn't have to worry about getting sent off to some foreign country if that's a concern and it will help you stay in school. Don't scoff at the at the Coast Guard, they're a bona fide branch of the military and when I was in the USMC their boot camps were equally long at thirteen weeks and equally tough. They have excellent equipment and facilities and also have any small arms type firearms you could possibly want to service. Good luck with your decision.

...also, if you DO choose to go to school, work towards some type of engineering degree. The world will ALWAYS need engineers. Okay, that's all.

This thread got opinion heavy quick. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

The miltary can not change your job specialty if it has been specified in your contract unless you fail to meet the requirements of the contract. In other words, if you fail to learn and complete your mission required by your job they can reassign you.

As for education opportunities, there are many. You even get scholarships from the different branches before joining if you want to go the officer route. Then there's tuition assistance, GI Bill and like the Army told you, you can be sent to college while serving. I did.

When I joined, I had a BA in fine arts and since joining picked up a degree from SU in public communications, so it can be done, but is not easy if your job makes you work a lot of hours.

I will refrain from posting my opinions here and keep my posts fact based. If you want my opinions, it will have to be privately.

Sorry Arch, but this is laughable. <--my opinion. sorry

Ask anyone who has worked in a miltary armory which is the most common weapon they work on, and the M4/16 will be the answer. However, there are about 50 models in the average armory. They range from the M9 to the 50 Cal sniper and machine gun/M2 to the latest XM-25.

The contract sounds like it would clear away some of the fears about joining I had.

You always sign a contract when you enlist. But if you sign an "open" contract, they will place you int he job field that is the most needy with little regard for your wishes. I wouldn't sign and open contract, but some do.

Definitely DO NOT sign an open contract. Get something guaranteed . That's what I did and I got exactly what I signed the contract for.

I will throw out the lowly vote for looking into the Guard. I could be misunderstanding you, but it sounds like you are NOT looking to do a career stint as a .mil. If that is the case, the Guard will give you tons of opportunity, the ability to live where you want (all things being equal of course) and will do you very well when it comes to tuition assistance. Not sure where you live, but out here in God's country (Colorado) Guard members get a sweet deal for state schools, and here (God's country again) we have state gunsmithing schools. Do the .mil thing, get paid to get edge-u-ma-cated, and better the future prospects for yourself and that of your family. Also, the Guard (can't speak to how this works in active duty) will let you cross train and pick a diversified work experience should you want to and there is a need. This can be a huge bonus in a competitive civilian work environment. Furthermore, you'll likely get a security clearance (and one that remains active) and that can be a big asset for a number of civilian job opportunities (even for silly civilian engineers/architects <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> ) Just food for thought.

Damon makes a good point. Reserves/guard is not a bad deal.

I would also ask the Gunsmithing School counselors what it really takes to succeed in your profession.
I've made a few "poor" choices in my life and a few good ones. Find a successful Gunsmith and see what they are doing and what it takes to do what they do.

Yet, another solid point. Brain pick your local gun dealers/smiths.

I think you misunderstood my point. I was saying that in the military you're going to be working predominately on the M16 family of weapons.

In the civilian world you're not.

When I was working in a gun shop 90% of our "projects" were related to what the owner called "Fudd Guns" (hunting weapons) and predominately gas operated self loading shotguns.

My point in a nut shell:

Military = Mostly M16
Civilian = Everything Else

Good point.

I hope I didn't come off as offensive to you as I highly respect you (honestly).

But, I guaranty a military armorer works on shotguns more often than a civilian one. I think you are making judgments of a military job without actually experiencing it.

We don't carry too many bolt actions, but we do, and we use a ton of shotguns. A Marine in the 21 field (not sure what the other services call it) has to know the uncommon weapons just as well as the common ones.

Name a type of weapon and I bet we use it. Armorers deal with them all.

That's a true statement ^^^

I assumed with the M16 being issued in some form continuously from 1963 to today (48 years of being the standard issue weapon for the Air Force, Army and Marines) it would be the predominate system for armors to work on.

You know what they say happens when you ASSuME something.

It is. But to perform your job proficiently, you would fail if you could only fix/modify one weapon. A mechanic can't fix every car if all he knew how to fix was a gas tank.

Our most used weapons are the M16/4, 249, 240, M2, MK19, M9 (soon to be changed, the are looking at many option and I am hoping for a 45), Benelli M4, etc etc. We have a basic weapon, M16/4, and we have specialty weapons.

I think the strangest / scariest thing I experienced while working at the gun shop was:

We had a non-english speaking (just enough to be 10% functional) customer buy a black powder muzzle loader (45 caliber) and then use a bullet puller to dissemble 45Acp ammunition. He then proceeded to put 50 ROUNDS worth of 45Acp powder down the barrel and patched a 32 caliber ball with a section of underwear elastic. Fortunately for him - he didn't understand that a cap was needed on the nipple to ignite the thing.

On the other hand - we could have cleaned out the shallow end of the gene pool by just handing him a $0.02 cap......

Slightly OT, but do you see many Benelli M4? Any feedback on the system?

I like my personal 870, since I trust a pumop more than an auto, but the M4 is what I was trained on. I haven't heard any complaints about it from Marines who use it daily.

It is the standard security weapon. Guarding gates and such.

Thanks.

I've been wondering how Benelli's gas operated system is performing (the M1, M2 and M3 are inertia driven...well the M3 is inertia in auto mode but is convertible to a pump by flipping a switch).

When I was trained for the auxiliary security forces in Afghan-land, I used the M4. It is a great weapon. the only issues I had were my fault. I put about 700 rounds through a well used gun (the bluing was rubbed down to the shinny metal in parts) and it didn't have any function issues.

I'd trust it with my life as I would an M16.

Arch, check this weapon. I have held it, but not fired it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p4ebtj1jR7c

I've seen those on TV only.

There is a local firm make drums for Saiga-12's. I was at the range when they were testing their final prototype. They were tired of testing and handed me a 12 Gauge AK, two drums and lots of ammo....

It was pretty impressive.

Found a link to their site...

http://www.alliancearmament.com/

Here's the drum I was allowed to "beta test"...

http://www.alliancearmament.com/alliancearmament30rddrum.aspx

The range in the video is the range I've been going to since 1983. Its a great place, because you literally never know what's going to show up.

I've seen everything from belt fed machine guns to FLAME THROWERS there.

I have fired a lot of weapons, even sent 155 mm down range, but flame throwers!

gundog, what you dont understand is that small arms mechanics work on SMALL ARMS AND CAN SERVICE ALL TYPES OF WEAPONS SYSTEMS. I am an Ordnance officer. i handle ammunition, explosives, and various types of munitions - as well as track the soldiers who work on weapons systems. my howitzer mechanics work on small arms as well. you need to do your research and know what you are talking or asking about before you go see a recruiter.

look up 91 series jobs within my branch, Ordnance. its all weapons systems maintenance. we are the largest branch in the entire army. and our guys do everything from mounted patrols to maintenance on weapons to traffic control points, etc. there is no other soldier in the us army that is as versatile as a 91 series ordnance soldier. anyone who knows will tell you this!

M16 = way of the past. m4 is far better and what i have carried here this entire year. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Benelli M4 shotgun

OH WOW, If I was Bill Gates, all you guys would have one of those AA12 shotguns!

Thanks for the interest guys. I am making a long list of questions to ask the recruiters.

Good for you GD. And don't let them sidetrack you. If they get off on a tangent just let them know the Q&A is over unless they get back on track.

I think you misunderstood this one. I/We were talking about the M4 Benelli shotgun not a rifle.

I have a page of questions so far. can you guys put in some suggestions of things to ask?

1) What happens if I fail in anyway?
2) What happens if I get injured?
3) Will I get deployed? If yes, where?
4) Under what circumstances can you "breach contract"?
5) Under what circumstances can you change my MOS direction?

reconseed I am having a hard time finding anything about your job and the enlisted positions there. the only thing I have found is people talking about mechanic type jobs that have nothing to do with firearms. can I get a web link from you that would help me find out what you do.

I love guns but I really would like to keep the gun chat down on the thread.

THIS IS ABOUT ME TRYING TO GET INFO ABOUT A IMPORTANT DECISION.

thanks

I am assuming Reconseed's job is in the Ordnance Corps, Branch 91. The enlisted jobs he is talking about, I'm assuming, are in the Maintanance, Field 91. Here is a link on info there. http://usmilitary.about.com/od/enlistedjobs/a/91.htm

Sorry for sidetracking your thread.

We, gun nuts get carried away at times.

Gun guns guns! It's out of my system now. Carry on with your decision making <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I just finished up to books looking for info. one is a book called "MARINE" by Tom Clancy. it is a book about the Marine MEU (SOC)and is none fiction, it had some good info. the other two were written by Chuck Holton a former army ranger. his books are called "A more elite soldier" and "bullet proof" bother were good.
I have looked into the army position that reconseed talked about and JJ helped me find some info on that job as well. My main interest is military spec-ops type weapons. and I really want to work in the customization and deployment of these types of arms. I was home schooled and when i was 11years old for six months I scared my mom by getting used climbing rope and fast roping from the balcony of my family's second story porch. I did get some rope burn<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I have no experience with the military but I have one friend who is about done with a 5 year contract with the Navy and another who just got through his first year of the Army. Needless to say, the worst thing they say about the military is the lack of freedom.

I would have to agree with that. Freedom is scarce in the junior ranks and depending on your unit, can be hampered in senior ranks too.

Easiest way I know of to work with Spec-ops weapons is to enlist as a 92Y (Unit supply specialist - ARMY) and be 110% certain you'll be working with a special ops unit. A large part of the responsibility (and soon, about the only thing a 92Y will do) is arms room, including maintenance and upgrading of the weapons contained within. I speak from experience, I'm being made obsolete with what is called CIF-ism. All of the MOLLE equipment my soldiers are recieving now is being sent from a CIF facility somewhere in the US, and all I do as the Yankee in my unit is facilitate paperwork to send to the CIF before they ship it. However, my section chief recently informed me we're supposed to be getting a pile of RIS systems to update our older M4s with (we're a reserve Aviation Unit, I still have 40 M16A2s in my arms room, 12 of which are Colts. 3 of those are red-x'ed, the sear springs are so fatigued they're inop. As soon as the supply system unscrews itself and sends me my replacements, I can get them fixed), and me being as technically capable with firearms as I am, he thought I'd be a shoo-in to do the work. You'll have to pick up a secondary MOS as armorer, but that's only a 1 and a half week course. Since it's such a short course, they won't allow you to enlist as JUST an armorer. 92Y school included a week and a half of Standard US weapons maintenance, so you'll get to work with the most common US small arms. I can field strip anything from a Mk-19 to an M9. the M107 was a trip, and another private nearly killed himself trying to reassemble an M2. fun times <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />.

Sadly, though, the Army is downsizing, and from what I understand from speaking with my recruiter, active duty isnt even accepting new enlistees for anything, door kicker included. There's also no such thing as a "reserve" Special Ops unit. However, if there happens to be an opening, I'd take advantage of it, especially if it drops you in as support personnel for a Special OPs group, because that would open up the door to you to take a shot at becoming Spec-ops yourself. It sounds like, with the fast roping from the balcony, that you're heading in that direction anyways.

Now my question to you, are you interested in working with the firearms technically, or do you just want to pull triggers? If you just want to pull triggers, go in on a Ranger contract, and work your way up from there. And be warned, even IF you do get into a spec-ops unit, you may not neccessarily get to play with the toys you want to. Even with such a small community of personnel, the newest, most special toys like the SCAR and ACR are only ordered in small quantities, and then they are distributed amongst all branches of the services, and only fielded by certain units. A SEAL team may have access to just about anything they want, and the GPCs to back it up, but don't count on a Ranger Battalion having the same wherewithal to buy whatever they feel like. To pull triggers on any weapon you could possibly want, you'd have to be tip top of the spear, and that is very difficult to achieve.

I want to be able to pull the trigger and be able to fix and maintain any weapon system ours or other country's. But fast roping and HALO jumping would be awesome. After I would get out of the service
I would like to get a job with a military weapons disign and manufacturing company.

Thanks for the info. I will check out what you recommend

There are special OPS National Guard units. Specifically 19th Special Forces Group. One right in Colorado.

I stopped at the local army recruiters yesterday. He said that the only way to work as a amorer is to do the 92y and then take the 14 day armorer course. But you can't work as a full time armorer. He said to work in spec-ops is to be 21 and sign up as as special forces candidate and you will be assigned to the army's needs Intill you can try out. If you fail (which I would die before failing) you get put were the army wants you. I asked about the 75 ranger regiment because I have heard and read that special forces recruits out of the rangers. But he didn't know anything about them. The only thing he knew is about how you can get a ranger tab for your self. Every one can try to go though the ranger course and get the tab. I was trying to find out about the actual rangers but he didn't know anything about it.

The guys was not very good. If you go the the army's recruiting web sit they say see a recruiter but the recruiter says go to the army's web site. That was annoying.

If you are interested in the army find a different recruiter. That guy doesn't sound to motivated. Even if he is giving you answers that you don't want to hear.

Any one looking at the recruiter remark needs to
Read the
End
Of the last page

And I will be talking to other recruiters.

I also will checkout the airforce combat control position. It would be
Different than my original firearms interest but it would be a SF job.

A friends brother was a airforce combat control and I should talk to him and see what it was like.

But my main interest is small arms.

About the Rangers: My buddy joined last year, like I said, he had a special forces contract and made it through land navigation selection but then got med-pulled with 2 or three days left. He is now doing Ranger selection, but what you do is go through BASIC then, RASP, then you get deployed for x amount of time, come back then do Ranger school. You don't really do HALO training for Rangers unless you do Ranger Battalion, I think. Also you have to do Airborne first.

When I was younger, Special Forces Assessment & Selection required a prior Army enlistment (ie - you serve your 4-6 with a perfect record and then apply for Selection) or cross qualifications (Navy UDT or Marine Recon with Para and Scuba).

Special Forces Qualification Course (Q) had an enormous failure rate even among Tri-Bodies (Jump School, USMC Recon or Ranger School, and Scuba).

This information is coming from a pre-SOC knowledge. Now that Special Operation Command is basically a branch of military within all the branches of military I can't speak to the SPAS process.

The SF selection process has changed greatly over the years. For a more up to date idea watch 2 weeks in hell. Except right after that show it changed to a 3 week process.

I need to watch that.

MB - thanks for the updated info.

soon i hope to talk to the Marine and Air Force recruiters.

Remember to go early in the month so they aren't in a bind to meet their mission.

thanks JJ. I am getting every book I can find about taking the ASVAB.

I highly recommend "ASVAB for Dummies." I joined at 28 years old and was worried I had lost a lot of the high school skills/knowledge that would be on the test. To help with that I went to the library and picked up the Dummies book. It helps one find what they are weak in and just focus on that. I scored really high after using that book and that opens up all the jobs for me since I scored high enough to qualify for all of them.

it is in my library book pile right in front of me with some ARCO, kaplan, and other books on it.

I also started to spend more time on my PT.

I tell you what, gd, you're definately going to be more prepared than most of the other recruit candidates. I was three years out of high school and did NOTHING to prepare. I did happen to score high on the ASVAB and I was still in excellent shape, but I still feel it was foolish of me not to prepare. JJ is right on about scoring as high as possible on the ASVAB. It's not difficult to pass, but the higher score the better. You could have your pick of any MOS out there. Also, are you a good swimmer? It's something that needs to be considered when applying for those SF type jobs.

I love to swim. my parents had me take YMCA swim lessons about the same time I learned to walk. i did it for 6 years and when I lived at a camp in Michigan for 4 years I had a lake to swim in. I spent a good chunk of my summer in water. I got so I could stay under water long enough that the lifeguards would ask my sister if I was ok<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I have started to read all the books I have out from the library and have gotten some good info about enlisting and how to talk and interact with recruiters. I am also studying up about the ASVAB. I don't like to half @$$ anything!!!

anyone have any tips for a good pt routine? if so list them out.

RUN, RUN AND RUN SOME MORE. Also do pushups and pullups and setups with weights attached to you. Then run some more, WITH WEIGHTS!

Check out the Armstrong program for pullups. It works. I was stuck at 16 pull ups no matter how hard i trained until I started this program. http://manlypat.wordpress.com/2009/02/24/armstrong-pull-up-program/

I will also repeat what Randy said (just don't tell him I agreed with a chairmen), RUN RUN and RUN SOME MORE. This isn't that important if you plan to join the Air Force or Navy, but it is still important. If you plan to join the Marines or the Army, it is very important and will affect your career progression as will your situps and pullups (Marines) and pushups (Army).

Do not just focus on those three or four exercises though. You need all around strength to perform well in the Army and the Marines. The Army is going to adopt our Combat Fitness Test, so all around strength is needed. This includes Movement to Fire - timed 880 yard sprint in boots and utes, Movement Under Fire - seen in the video below and ammo can lifts - 30 pound can lifted as many times as you can from below the chin to straight up arms locked out in 2 minutes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuw7fh4zfck

Haha, to late JJ, I saw where you agreed with me! GD, ENDURANCE and STRENGTH. Both are important, and as JJ said, more so in the Marines and Army. Running gives you stamina, staying power. Strength gives you the ability to "Getter done" once you get there.

Wow, that's a full course there! Great video <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" />

Thanks guys! My pt today is moving 2 tons of rock and sand by hand

Nice video!

I actually just watched the video in its entirety and apologize for showing it now. That is a recruit in boot camp running the course slowly and sloppily. It looks like he finished in just under 3 minutes. That is a poor score. A perfect score is 0:2:14.

Here's a link to a great website for your research and some info on our standards. http://www.military.com/military-fitness...at-fitness-test

thanks JJ. I thought he was a little slow. but then again I wasn't the one doing it.

I was looking and it looks like the army has a ranger contract. all you have to do is be tough enough. but the federal government just announced that the army and marines will be letting go over a 100,000 people. I imagine that it would hard to get where you want with all the changes in these branches.

On the running side, I would say run 4x a week and would build up to 6-8 miles. From wherever you are at now, add 5-8 minutes for a week on the longer run. Have one day be a speed/strength day...hills, sprints, up your speed for like 2 lengths of telephone poles...slow it down/speed it up again.

For strength I like super-sets myself...body weight and plyometrics are nice. If you have a rope set up for climbing, that will build some sweet upperbody strength that's useful.

The Army and the Marines are shrinking. I know last year we recruited 40,000+ young men and women in to the Marines. That has been the standard for the last decade. This year the goal for the Marine Corps is 22,000. That is a nearly 50 percent cut. They are making it harder to stay in as well. If you do not reach staff sergeant in rank (E-6) by your 10 year mark, you can not re-enlist. This is a big reason I requested to come to this training. I need to stay competitive. If not, the Army will take me and let me keep my rank <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

They also implemented a new retirement plan to shrink the numbers. You can now retire at 15 years instead of 20. You would receive 35 percent of your pay for the rest of your life if you elect early retirement at 15 years. They add a few percentage points for every year after that until you reach 20 years and get the full retirement at 50 percent.

That said, we still need to keep the junior ranks fresh. As people inevitably get promoted past pvt., pfc and lance corporal we have to replenish the stock of worker bees. It is the same in the Army.

So, you can join the Marines if you don't have any serious criminal records and a high school diploma or just a GED for the Army. You will likely be put on the Delayed Entry Program until there is a spot for you in boot camp. This is a good thing as the recruiters hold weekly functions to prepare you for basic training. They do physical training and general military knowledge classes. At least that is how the Marine recruiters do it. I am not sure about the other services.

thanks JJ. I can run 2 miles with ease and four with some effort. The book i just read also talked about DEP. I have NO criminal record and a home school diploma that the recruiter said would be fine. I am continuing to research and read everything I can find.

I am looking at several branches but the three I am interested in are the Army, Marines, and Air Force. I cant find out online about the MOS options with the Marines though. I am trying to find time to go see the Air Force and Marine recruiters but my construction jobs keep filling in my schedule.

Here you go.

http://usmilitary.about.com/od/enlistedjo2/a/marinejobs.htm

thanks JJ. I am no running a minimum of 2.5 miles if I don't have a construction job that day. and I am adding the push ups and setups to the workout.

Is the Marine MOS 72 similar to the Air Force combat control position?
I am looking into the Air Force SOF jobs and most of them sound good.

Never worked with either. As far as I know the 72 field has air traffic controllers and stuff like that. I can ask around tomorrow, we have Marines of all makes and models at this course. I will see what I can find out for you.

Our MOS is defined by four numbers. Mine is 4341. The first two numbers define the field. 43 in mine means I am in the public affairs field. The last two numbers define the specialty within that field. The 41 in mine means I am in the combat correspondent (photojournalist) specialty. There is also a 13 or broadcast journalist specialty in my field.

That said, which specialty in the 72 field in the Marine Corps are you talking about. If you follow that link I post and click on the field you are interested in, you can find out more about each specialty by clicking on the ones in the list.

Weapons tactics instructor looks like it might be what you are interested in. It is the 7277 MOS.

http://usmilitary.about.com/od/enlistedjo2/a/7277.htm

However, after a second look, that is a job for the experienced. You can not enlist in that. You must work your way up too it from another job in the 72 field. It is a very specialized and expert job.

Also check out the 21 field. http://usmilitary.about.com/od/enlistedjo2/a/21.htm

That is not the job you're looking for. I was a 6173 with secondaries of 6113 and 6177. I attended WTCCI in Yuma to get the 6177 mos and it looks like 7277 is also some type of advanced aviation weapons instructor designation. It may be the instructors that train the WTCCI students. After graduation the students become instructors back in their respective squadrons.

My above post was in regards to 7277, looks like it's basically a combat ATC instructor.

JJ is (or at least was) correct. When I was still in, I was a In Airfield Management, in the same category (sort of) as Air Traffic Controllers and Combat controllers.

Ok just did some Googlefu and came up with this for the Air Force.

1C - Command and Control Systems Operations
United States Air Force Command and Control Badge.svg

1C0X2 - Aviation Resource Management
1C1X1 - Air Traffic Control
1C2X1 - Combat Control
1C3X1 - Command Post
1C4X1 - Tactical Air Control Party (TACP)
1C5X1 - Command & Control Battle Management Ops (1C5X1D Weapons Director)
United States Air Force Weapons Director Badge.svg
1C6X1 - Space Systems Operations
1C7X1 - Airfield Management

So by this NEW set of numbers I would have been a 1C771

1 - Operations
C - Command and Control Systems
7 - Airfield management
7 - Craftsman (Airmen with many years of experience in the specialty, responsible for supervision and training)(one step below Superintendent)
1 - Base Operations
I Guess? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Anyway, My OLD AFSC (Air Force Specialty Code) was 27171.

Right now I am doing some digging and checking out the airforce SOF jobs. A friends brother is a airforce combat control that worked with several SOF groups. I want to talk with him about his job and see what it's like.

JJ what is the marine job that works at the quantico armory and loads the match ammo, works on builds the M40 a3 system and maintains the corps 1911s. I also heard the build and maintain the marine corps match shooting teams guns. I have read about the those guys but can't find much info.

It is most likely a special duty within the 2111 field http://usmilitary.about.com/od/enlistedjo2/a/2111.htm

I would assume this is not a job you would go directly into. Most likely you have to excel at your job and be experienced as an armorer and PFT, CFT etc etc and then get selected or apply for the position.

I just got directed to this order by a Marine here that used to work on the Marksmanship Training Unit, Weapons Training Battalion, Marine Corps Development and Education Command. I believe this is what you are talking about. The sergeant told me you have to be great at your job as an armorer and be really good on the range. Good enough to get selected to the rifle and pistol competition teams.


http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...8kw&cad=rja

Thanks JJ

Anytime, brother.

I have started running at least 3 miles a day.

Even my dad has started to workout

I really want to see what the options are.

Today I ran 8 miles<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

oosh, how did that feel? Big jump up in milage!

I've done a lot of distance running and the recomended increase is like 10% a week of your longest distance. Every 3rd week, dial it back down to help muscles rebuild/recover. Just be careful! Train smart and avoid injury!

Sounds like you are working hard!

I was a little sore but it was awesome! I won't be doing it every day though.

I am trying to find info on the airforce special tactics squadrons. I found some interesting articles on what they do and it sounds pretty cool. You ever hear about them JJ?

Good on you- good to be young! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Looks like the airforce also has some cool sere jobs

I talked to an airforce recruiter and to a practice asvab. I did well on the practice test and he liked my experience and expertise. And he said it was awesome that I would be a great fit for sere, CCT, or pj but my vision won't let me do most of the jobs I want. I got some info and will be looking some stuff up.

He has a few buddys in sere and said that I would fit in great but there is very few job opening there like two a year

wow there are lots of jobs but I just cant find one that I qualify for with my vision and want to do for 4 years. maybe I need to look at guard and reserve jobs.

Don't overlook the Coast Guard.

I have thought about it but have a hard time with the thought of being on a ship all the time.

They have aircraft too and weapons specialist.

I just got a Marine recruiting packet in the mail. I didn't request any info are you in on this JJ <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Visit a CG recruiter, at least give it a fair chance. You'd be surprised at what they have to offer.

I will try to check out all the options.

Enlisted USAF Air Traffic Controller checking in. I know I'm late to the thread, but maybe I can answer some Q's on AF life if you have any.

USMC, its a life changing event. If I had it to do all over again, I would again enlist in the USMC. Semper Fi

Hi I just want to give everyone a update on whats going on. I have decided to attend the local Community College for the spring quarter. this will let me see how I like college and I can do some Math and other classes that would help to really boost my ASVAB scores. My interest for school will be in the beginning classes in engineering and also in marketing and sales/ public relations. since there seem to be few jobs in the military that fit my Gunsmith/and building interest I thought that I could look at the classes above to help in finding a job in the firearm industry that would be in research, product development,
sales & marketing, and product support. I want to mainly focus on the tactical markets because that's what I like. I also thought about looking for internships
with the tactical firearm companies. If college is not something I enjoy then I would look into the Airforce and Marines for jobs that would be centered in engineering and also in marketing and sales/ public relations. JJ arn't you in
public relations type role? I thought it could be fun to be a writer for guns&ammo or one of those magazines.