P A L

A bit of background first:

All of the Canucks on the forum here will be familiar with the Possession and
Acquisitions License required to own firearms.
For those who aren't Canucks, or for those Canucks who don't know of this, in
order to own a firearm in Canada (long rifle), you need to have a Possession and
Acquisitions license. This is only for long rifle (hunting rifle, shotgun, etc). This
doesn't apply to handguns, some semi-autos, full autos, etc...

To get the license you have to take a course, take a test, then (providing you
pass the test), fill out registration forms, bundle them up with a passport
photo, and the registration fees, send them off, wait 45 days, then (if you've
passed a criminal check), get your P.A.L license.

In September of this year, I took the "course", wrote the test (passed with
98%), then sent off my mug photo, the forms and the fees.
4 weeks went by, no response, then 5 weeks, then 6 weeks, and I'm getting
concerned a little.

On Tuesday when I got home, a pleasant surprise was waiting for me in the
mailbox....you guessed it, my PAL came in the mail.
I was happy, did the happy dance, phoned everyone I knew... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />


Now I have to figure out what kind of rifle I'm going to buy, then start saving
up for it...oh, and have to start saving up for bullets too.... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Just wanted to pass on the happy news to all.
Like the saying goes, I'm certifiably legal now, not legally certifiable... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Cheers all
DotD

Grats!

Congrats on the PAL!

I don't know what your primary use for this rifle will be, or whether or not you will be able to buy more than one, but if you are looking for an all arounder that you can count on ALWAYS I would highly suggest trying to find a nice Model 70 Winchester. When I say Model 70 I mean control round feed Model 70, and not one of the push feed model 70 that they made for a few years. Not that there is anything wrong with the push feeds, but if you are going to buy a Model 70 you might as well get the "Real Deal". The original Model 70s are called pre 64's, and they will be a little on the $$$$$ side, but you should be able to find a newer Model 70 Classic which is the re-release of the CRF action Model 70 that won't break the bank.

As for caliber choice, well, here's where everybody will give you their opinion and their's will always be the best...LOL! If you are looking for "One-Rifle" do-it-all set up I would suggest one of the .300 mags. My personal fav is the .300 Win Mag simply because ammo is easy to find if you don't reload, and recoil is mild for a belted magnum. In the non magnum class the 30.06 is always a classic stand by as is the .270Win. A couple of my personal favs are the .280Rem and the .308Win.

If you decide to go the lever action route I would suggest looking at the Marlin 1895 series rifles chambered in 45-70. They can be had in anything from 18.5-22" barrels and a few different configurations. I have a couple of them that I hog hunt with and they are they slickest, fastest handling little rifles you can imagine. That carry great in a saddle scabbard and when chambered in 45-70 you will never be under gunned.

Gratz!

It's thread like this that makes me feel how lucky I am to be in America. No license needed to buy rifles(including semi-auto). and we allow concealed carry here too.

I would start out small if money is a concern. something like a .22? Dirt cheap ammo means you can shoot all day with spare change.

my DO-it-all rifle would be the AR15. I'm not sure if you can own one over there tho..

Congrats on the PAL, DotD. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" />

Sounds like a very complicated process to have to go through... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/sad.gif" alt="" />

Happy hunting... for the rifle that is. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" />

Congrats!!! Another fellow Canadian gun owner. I myself am on a firearms purchasing "BREAK" After the first 50 guns.....It gets a little harder to figure out which one you need next. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

Thanks for the info Tolly,

I'm a lefty, so a bolt action is going to cost me more than regular unless I can
find a good used one. Like you mentioned, the bank is the primary concern on this.

I'm primarily going to be using it for predator protection when I go fishing.
Not really a hunter (wife is a vegan vegetarian, so no red meat at home.. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" /> )
I like to fish though, and most of my fishing happens in bear country.

I agree with you on the Marlins.
Marlin has a 1895G Guide lever action in .45/70 with an 18.5" barrel, which
looks like it would be perfect for my needs.
Also, I was looking at the Mossberg shotguns. A shotgun with slugs would offer
me good solid bear protection. Mossberg sells their 12 gauge 500 Persuaders in
a combo unit (28" and 18.5" interchangeable barrels).
Cabellas Canada has some good deals on Marlin's, and also on Mossberg

Like I said, my primary concern would be protection from bears.
Not really keen on being eaten if you know what I mean. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

Cheers

Bramel,

50 guns!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif" alt="" />
I'm just a babe in the woods compared to you <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowdown.gif" alt="" />

Remington 870 Express.

Good for bears and bad guys.

Here's my gun.

Good for you, congrats.

newDOGma,

That's a nice one, I've been thinking about a shotgun for awhile, but just might get me another semi-auto pistol, a .45ACP this time around.

a Shotgun will be my choice if its gonna be use for bear protection. a 12G remington 870 will do the job.

a bit off topic but can you guys own semi-auto pistol in Canada?

You will love the 1895G Marlin if you decide to go that route. I own an 1895G and a 22" barrel 1895 and I love both of them. The 1895G is so quick handling and natural pointing. If you are recoil sensitive put one of the Limbsaver recoil pads by SVL on it and your kids can shoot it. I can't say enough about these rifles.

The shotgun would edge out the Marlin if you were also going to use it as a self defense type of weapon. The combo deals where you can buy either the Mossberg 500/590 or Remington 870 with two barrels(an 18.5-20"&26-28") are definitely the way to go if you buy a shotgun. That will basically give you two guns.

That's what I was looking at only in the Mossberg flavor!!!
But I really like the Marlin lever 1875G too. My father (when he was alive) owned
3 Winchester lever actions. 30-30, 32, 45-50 with a hexagon barrel and I really
like them. Would still have them too, but my mom sold them after he passed on.

Yep, but it requires a restricted PAL license.
The restrictions on handguns here is crazy. So much so that I doubt that I would
ever own one.

Congrats!

Another vote for the 1895GS in .45/70. I love mine. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Next step if you get one is reloading gear. The Marlin can easily handle some sweet handloads, plus it is a lot cheaper than factory ammo!

I traded a Hanwei sword for it. Now I need to get a black rifle (AR-15).

Living in Utah has it's perks! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" />

so you guys can carry a rifle while fishing and not in the car loaded near your person?

I can't imagine carrying a rifle with all my fishing gear....a handgun would make more sense on a fishing day <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> a Ruger .454 comes to mind... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Congrats! I know it's a pain for Americans traveling to Alaska through Canada (ALCAN highway) to get guns through ~ $50 for each long gun. No handguns allowed at all.



...yet. - Another freedom that is constantly eroding.

Congrats!

I'll be shopping for my first handgun soon.

Congrats! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" />

Way to go pal, on your pal!

WOW... that is great! DotD I can appreciate the joy and the happy dance for sure. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

It makes me feel very lucky to be able to walk into any gun shop in Wisconsin and buy a rifle,shotgun,or any long rifle at all and walk out with it and the ammo within the amount of time it takes to write a receipt. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif" alt="" />
Things we sometimes take for granted are not enjoyed by others around the world. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

Good luck on buying the finest rifle you can afford and may it bring a lifetime of happiness and enjoyment. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" />


Peace.

Thanks all.
I've got it narrowed down to a Marlin 1895 Guide lever action 45-70
or a 12 gauge Remington 870 EXPRESS DEER GUN with a 20" barrel

Going to the gun store tomorrow to check them out.

Cheers all
DotD

It's amazing how things have changed since I was a kid. I'm 51 now, but
remember when I was 10, going into the gun store with my dad and having him walk
out with a .243 Browning and a couple of boxes of shells for the princely sum of
$310. He still needed a $5.00 hunting license, but a couple of weeks later, he
bagged a buck.

Now, I need a PAL license to own the rifle, a separate hunting license to be
permitted to hunt, and multiple tags to go hunting.
Maybe it's a good thing that my wife is vegan, and that I don't eat much meat <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

The world sure has changed, and I'm afraid that it doesn't look like it's been a
change for the better either.

Both are excellent guns. I'd have a HARD time deciding too!

Both will probably serve you a life time of enjoyment. The only solution would be to get both <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Own a Mossberg 500 here. The XD-40 is under the bed and the shotgun is in the corner.

Regarding the controls/constraints you are under in Canada, there is a scramble on down here in Florida at the gun shops. October sales are way ahead of normal because of the concern that there will be more control here after the general election next week.

I was just watching this a few months back...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nmrqT9SIkQw&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qGVAQOUi6ec&feature=related

as far as I know gun control is how tight of a group you can make on paper...

id get the 870

you can shoot anything from bird shot,buckshot, or rifled slugs.



1895 you are limited in the overall usefulness of the gun



870 pros-
bird shot= small game
buckshot= medium size game & self defense
slugs= self defense & big game


1895 pros-
heavy caliber



con-

most factory ammo is loaded on the "light" side for the older trapdoors and older guns


just my thoughts

KENKEN,

It is a real issue here, and even though the clip you quoted was done in 2001,
the battle is still going on. The cost of the registration program at the time
the clip was made, was in the hundreds of millions of $$. Now, it's in the
Billions of $$ with no end in sight.

In the last 7 years, it has become an entrenched institution of government, and
it is doubtful that it will ever end, although the present government is talking
about scrapping it. It is yet to be seen if the political will is indeed there.

Cheers.

Vance,

Thanks for the info. I'm going to the gun store tomorrow to look at both.
Originally I was looking at the Mossberg 500 combo unit, but the gun store
is sold out of them. So I'm going to look at the 870 instead.

I'll report back after I get a chance to look at them.

Based on what you say, I too think that the shotgun would be more useful.


Cheers

just another random thought...if its that tough to get firearms up there...


the 870 has a steel receiver & the mossberg is aluminium...the mossberg 500 also has a plastic safety....they break often enough that i keep steel ones in stock


i have a 870

I reload so I would be strongly biased to the 45-70. If I didn't reload and could have only one firearm I'd look at the 870 or similar. As Vance pointed it, shotguns are very versatile and with modern sabot cartridges can lay down some serious stopping power for shorter shots.

Vance,
I didn't know that about the Mossbergs. With that in mind, I will look more
seriously at the 870.

Kraz,
I don't have any ability to reload at this time, but I really like the 45-70.

This is becoming a difficult choice.

Cheers.

The "express" model which is a cheaper version of the 870 have plastic trigger guard. Doesn't matter to most people, but some thinks that part should be metal and not plastic.

Congrats on the P.A.L.! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" /> Twenty years ago I bought the Mossberg 500 "security combo" - 18" and 28" barrels, for $119.95. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> I still have it, and it's a very good shotgun. I also have a Remington 870 Express Magnum, and it is a fine firearm as well. A shotgun gives you more versatility as pointed out, and would be my choice if limited to only one firearm. Fortunately, I am not that limited. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Tell me about it, then I discovered knives and the madness continues, only a different type of madness

S/B, many of us suffer the same affliction! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/doh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I always carry my Remington 870 Police model, in either the 18" or 12.5" barrel configuration. When I go into the back country....as already mentioned, more versatility with choice of ammo.

A nice set of Scattergun tech. tritium ghost ring sights will be a great addition to you 870......ask me how I know?

Bramel,

I'm afraid to ask <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

OK ALL,

Thanks for all the input on the decision.
I went to the gun store and held both of them and loved them both.
They even had a 1895G in Stainless Steel which looked and felt great.

In the end it came down to money. The Remington 870 was $200 cheaper
and that is what carried the day.

They have a lay-away plan, so I have officially put on lay-away,
a 870 "EXPRESS COMBO" with a 20" Fully Rifled Deer Barrel & 26"- Vent
Rib Barrel

Again, my thanks to all who gave me their opinions pro and con on both
models.
Should have it before Christmas, so when I get it, pictures will be
forthcoming.

DotD

Congrats on an excellent choice DotD ! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" /> You will be happy with it. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Congrats on getting your PAL, and your first choice of shotgun. Depending where you hunt, you'll be able to use it for fowl, deer, moose, bear, turkey, pheasant, and just about anything else you can think of.

I've got a Stoeger P350, and love it. A lot of people say it has jamming problems, but I've fired and fired it, and haven't had one problem. My next shottie will either be a Benelli Supernova or Super Sport, with a 28" barrel.

If you decide to get a Marlin down the road, you can't go wrong with their lever action, in a 30-30 caliber. I've got one and love it for bush hunting; I've got mine set up with peep sights. For open field hunting, I've got my bolt action Browning A-bolt 30-06, and I love everything about it. The weight, action, feel of the trigger; the only thing that annoyed me about it was the stupid gold colored trigger, which I immediately corected. If the cost of ammo wasn't so pricey, I'd be firing it at the range every day I could. After that, I'd say my two Lee Enfield 303s are fun as well. One has the old iron sights, the other has peep sights. I love them, and have a blast everytime I take them to the range. They're typically the rifles I use to introduce newbies to firing. I'm sure you'll get into the hobby and find your own favorites; just figured I'd share some of mine.

Congrats on the 870 DotD! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" />

Second to last PAL post...

Originally, I was going to get this one put on a lay-away plan


but they made a mistake and put this on lay-away instead



So I'm getting a Remington 870 EXPRESS DEER GUN · Hardwood stock, fully rifled with sights instead of the combo.
Can't really complain that much as it saved me well over $100 and I can order a replacement barrel at anytime for about $50.
Will post a picture of the shotgun when I get it fully paid for and can get my paws on it.

Thanks for all the advice and input Dawgs!
It was really helpful in making the decision.

I was really seriously thinking about the Marlin Guide gun like ColdOne has,
but one look at the cartridge scared me off. That bullet looked about the size of a womans lipstick container...it was huge <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />
I grabbed this comparison picture off the internet.
Left to right: .30-30 .308 .45-70

Yep, that's the 45-70 all right; a buddy of mine has one, and i personally didn't like it. I can do just as much with my 303, 30-30, and 30-06, as he can do with that 45-70 of his. I suppose it's what you're used to as well, though. I personally have never needed a caliber larger than the 3 I just listed. But, again, to each their own.

So, DotD, what rifle caliber are you going to settle on, if you decide to get one?

Congrats, you will love the 870...

tyger75,
I'd love to get a .30-30, but funds are tight. Maybe if I could pick up a used
one somewhere relatively cheap, that would be cool.
But then I'd have no money for knives!!!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif" alt="" />
Have to think that one over... rifle...knives...rifle...knives... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif" alt="" />

I'm sure looking forward to using the 870.

There's always the chance to buy a nice secondhand lever action 30-30 off a few websites I know; that's how I got most of my Marlins! Best bush rifle you can own is the Marlin 336 lever 30-30, IMHO. You don't need a scope on it either, just the iron sights, or go a little fancy and get peep sights on it (I did, and love 'em). <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" />

If you want them, let me know, and I'll send you the links; they're all Canadian businesses, so no worries about Duty crossing the border.

I put an aperture rear on an SKS and I love it. My benelli has peep sights, though a much much wider aperture, and it is awesome too. The 7.62x39 has very similar ballistics to the 30-30 if you'd prefer a semi-auto and you don't have any wierd laws or bans on them.

The only thing I don't like about it is that it locks in through the takedown lever slot. I couldn't get the pin to move at all in the lever so I just cut it out with a cutting wheel on a dremel tool. So its a lot slower to take apart now. its actually pretty nimble though without a bayonet on it.

That would be something I'd be really interested in.
Could you pm me the links?


darkaether,

I'm not sure about the restrictions on semi-auto's here, but I've looked at
the SKS too. Kinda looks like a M1 Garand but I'm not very knowledgeable when
it comes to rifles.

I was also looking at possibly getting a Lee Enfield or a Parker Hale bolt
action (.303 I think it was).

Cheers
Dave
DotD

DOD, just sent you the PM; also, if you're looking at a Lee Enfield, you'll find plenty of them for sale on those two links, both sporterized and original. Good prices too. I own two of them, and like 'em almost as much as my Marlins. Looks like you're developing quite the good taste in firearms! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

As for the semi-auto question; anything that is recognized as a "black rifle" is pretty much requiring your Restricted PAL (some exceptions), and cannot be used for hunting; only range use. Might want to double check that last point though, I'm not completely sure on it.

Canadian firearm laws are very confusing. Can you guys own something like an AR15? I know concealed carry of handgun is no no there. seems like a very long trip just to own rifles... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif" alt="" />

AR15 is a definite "black rifle", which means you need a Restricted Possession Acquisition Liscence ( AKA, an RPAL) to buy and own one. I'm pretty sure you can't hunt with it, and you must be a member of a gun club and have an ATT (Authorization to Transport) to take it to and from the gun clubs' firing range, by the most direct route only. There's a whole crap load of rules and regs in reference to owning any firearms that are considered restricted, such as the "black rifles", and any type of handgun. Very annoying!

I found those links awhile back and its somewhat related to the topic

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nmrqT9SIkQw&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qGVAQOUi6ec&feature=related

I hope America doesn't become the next target...

The cartridges are incorrectly labeled in the post. The one on the left is the .308, 30-30 (thutty thutty) is in the middle, and 45-70 on the right.

Thanks Kraz,
I'm still pretty green with things.
Took the picture off the internet and just put down what the
caption said.


DotD