End of the World as we Know it?

So I was buying ammo at the local SGS and I ran into a guy who works at a think tank. Former congressional candidate. Smart guy. He starts in about how we've got about three years. The economic models his think tank runs show the economy heading for collapse within about 3 years. Non-discretionary spending outstrips annual tax revenue by almost a trillion dollars a year. Add in discretionary spending and we are outstripping revenue by several trillion per year. He then talked about how his firm is now encouraging the government to spend so it hits that wall sooner and we can get on to the next phase--the sooner we collapse the sooner we recover.

That said, he said his think tank is looking at three years until recovery begins. In the interim, he's looking at three years of chaos--like the meltdown in Greece, only on a far grander scale since our economy is bigger and our debt crisis far more deep. His group is advocating 10k rounds per platform, at least a year of food, and a plan to survive as a community.

Now, I don't know him or his think tank but what he said made a lot of sense. So, my questions:

1. Anyone else hearing this?

2. Anyone else putting stock in this?

3. Anyone got 10k in 223, 22, 45, and 9mm they wanna loan me for the next 6 years?

WOAH! Sounds (Timewise) like the 7 years in Revelation. Kinda makes you think.

I'm not big into doomsday (mainly because I don't like to live in ignorance) but this one sounded feasible.

Sooo.....you got some ammo for me Randy?

Yes I believe it and all my studying of info agrees with it. Prep or die

Hehe only if you try to take what I have.

I couldn't hold out for weeks on end, but I could keep the riff raff at bay for a while.

And I also have a full supply of Dan's Ginsu Knives! Plus a couple three swords.

That's a stark way to put it

Well ya can't sugar coat something like this. In the last year I have met dozens of people who also believe the same way and are prepping.
They talk about rebuilding our economy. But what have the rebuilt it on?
They have just thrown money at the problem, in the process that have devalued the dollar and have only made the inevitable worse.
Follow survival blog. Lots of good info there and it only takes a few minutes of your day

Sigh.

So the Mormons were right!

I don't like to be a pessimist, but I don't like what I'm seeing. Ammo prices were really low in 2010-11, I wish I had more money then to stock up.

We always are

Now DT, there was that one time back in 1776.....

Well, Greece ain't a swarm of chaos...

If you go there, people are just going about with their own bussiness.
Sure they have problems, big ones, but it ain't chaos.
Remember; most of us, Danes, Greek and Americans alike are civilized people, and will behave civilized in the event of a economic meltdown.

Many people like to paint a way too grimm picture.

Civilized, yes. But I think if the USG tried to seize people's savings it wouldn't end well. I think there is a great deal more distrust of our govt here than there is generally in Europe and more of a widespread culture of "don't tread on me". The debt crisis would be worse than Greece by several fold.

Who knows what will happen on the future? Not I. Just think the Boy Scouts have it right: "Be prepared." Hopefully, you don't ever need to use your prep, but better to have and not need than need and not have Prepare for the worst and pray for the best

You've got that right. It's another reason why I'm interested in SY knives - rugged and well-built enough to last me through most any situation.

Exactly DT our country was formed on distrust of the government and that sentiment has resurfaced for good reason. I think Europe is far to trusting of there governments and we see where that is getting them.

Europe's population is drastically changing with low birth rates contrasted with immigrats with high birth rates. I don't think we'll recognize Europe in 100 years - it'll be an extension of North Africa/Arabia.

Hey, nothing wrong with being prepared!
Only a years worth of food and 10k rounds? That would end up taking up all the time you have, for things like a day job.
Usually people who come from a think tank have a political agenda, and want to paint a picture that benifits them. I bet this guy want to win votes for the Republicans. And ok by me, they would get my votes, did I live in the US.

Well, if distrust in the government will end up causing chaos and anarchy (I added anarchy for dramatication ) in the event of a economic meltdown, I would prefer trust and a peacefull economic meltdown.

That said, I this the EU is a hopeless project, and would much prefer a simple trade union.

the chaos is going to come from the government dependent ones who have no skills whatsoever IMHO not from those of us who can see the possibilities.

I'm not the only one worried about collapse. Some say that it's just because of the economic uncertanty - that it's a phase or a natural reaction - I'm not so sure about that. The birds can sense a storm coming before humans can see it. You have to watch for the signs. I think that might be what we're seeing now, but I can't be sure.

Well, I just heard something disturbing today!

Bees are dying in huge numbers all over the industrialized world.
The pulpit is pesticides.
Entire colonies are dying and the number of dying bees in beefarms has risen by an alarming rate.

To me, that is a greater danger to us. I think we would be able to float on top of an economic meltdown...

It never hurts to prepared for bad times. Lots of things can happen from natural disaster to losing a job. A healthy supply of stored foo means one less thing to worry about.

If you rotate out canned/dry goods and don't buy something you won't eat you will be just fine.

Its pretty nice to think you are out of something when you look in the pantry and realize you have a case in storage. Time to swap it out and buy another case.

Then again I believe in having a plan, a backup plan and then a couple more plans just in case. Its my personality.

Rasmus, Americans won't take as kindly to having their bank accounts emptied by the government as the Greeks have. The risk of bloody revolt is very real in that instance.

That said, I don't believe the 3 year forecast. While the economy was failing in Greece, alternative currencies like bitcoin flourished and enabled those savvy enough to use such alternatives to disconnect themselves from the failing government's financial system.

People over here advocate gold and other precious commodities, including ammunition for those purposes. And ultimately I think America is versatile enough that the country could survive on a bartering system while the "official economy" hit rock bottom. But it would take a very strong sense of community, something else that America has demonstrated to have in times of crisis.

Overall, I think the US will fare much better than the rest of the world in a similar upheaval. Mainly because of the people's determination (and ability) to protect themselves from those who would turn a situation like that into an opportunity to loot, rape, and kill.

As long as the US government is kept from disarming law-abiding people, and from importing 20-30 million more mouths to feed, I think we would be in good shape over all, even with a very bad crisis looming.

That said, I will soon be situated much better in a new home with more room, and I will be spending money on at least basic supplies. Maybe not 3 years worth though..

Three years supply of food is a bit drastic IMO. With a years supply I think you would be GTG. You can always supplement. Food storage doesn't have to be pricey. Five dollars a week extra towards storeable foods and it accumulates quickly. 10k rounds is doable for 22 and doesn't take up much space. 1-2k in other "survival" platforms is good. But if the government starts taxing ammo as an alternate form of gun control it might be nice to have a supply on hand

Like MB noted, there's lots of reasons to prepare. Doesn't need to be because of govt collapse. Storms, unemployment, or disasters of any sort can strike anyone anytime anywhere. Be prepared. It's just a good idea.

If you can't physically store a years worth of food, do what you can. I never want to be reliant on the govt or others in the event of emergency. If more of us prepared for the worst, the better able we would be to help each other in times of need.

I had three years worth of Twinkies stored up.

Well said MB

I am aware, that Greece and USA are populated by people of quite different mentality. My point was, that you can't base your fears of chaos on Greece, since no chaos reigns there.
Personally, I believe in being prepared, only you don't have to go overboard, which I think a year's worth of food and 10k rounds is.
In a country like the US natural disasters do occur, and of course you should be prepared for that. Hurricane Katrina was a stellar example of that. In DK we haven't EVER had any kind of disaster worth preparing for. Here I would rather have a prepared skillset, and gear to help me in that.

And I do believe in the good of man, should our economi collapse. That may be I, who is naive.
However I do also believe in the right to defend myself at gun point, should the need arise... But I have no guns

Interesting perspective. I'm LDS so I grew up with the mindset of always aiming for a years supply of food--its something our church has encouraged for generations. I've met lots of folks who wish they'd followed that council, lots who'd like to get into food storage, and lots who are ambivalent, but few who'd say a year's supply of food is overboard. Prudent yes, but not excessive. It stems, I think, from the fierce independence that most Americans feel, combined with the traditional values of self reliance and thrift (that unfortunately are in decline here and being replaced with dependence and entitlement...).

Curious why you'd feel a years supply is excessive? Not baiting an argument, but genuinely interested since its a mindset that is relatively alien to me.

I'm LDS too... I'd say self reliance and independence runs in the blood.

@DT
No worries, I appreciate the discussion, and questions to my point of view are welcome
I think it is excessive, purely because I can't imagine a situation, where you are cut off from being able to trade or bargain for a whole year. Or even grow your own vegetables or herbs. Or catch fish. Have your chickens lay eggs and ate the chicks.

I do not know what LDS means, so be so kind to enlighten me

No doubt, it is prudent to be prepared, especially where hurricanes, tornadoes and earthquakes are a risk.

No one has answered yet and I'm not LDS so please correct me if I am wrong. LDS is The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Also known as Mormons.

Now that was some good planning!

Hostess going down was a blow to my stress management.

Yes, that's right.

I've never seen having a years supply as something just for me. Rather, if there's a disaster or need, I will be in a place to take care of my own and others too.

Although, as MB pointed out, if you lose your job it's nice to have that to fall back on so you don't need to take govt assistance and can maintain your dignity. Lots of folks I've known that have needed to rely on their food storage to see them through tough economic times. Especially nowadays when people can easily be out of work or underemployed for over a year. The real unemployment rate in the US is still over 10 percent when factoring all those whose benefits ran out and are no longer being counted.

Well, one thing is for sure, there is no harm done it being prepared. And you are right; being able to help your self and those in your community is worth more than you can sum up in money and time spend.

So in that aspect, I understand.

I would not doubt that there are several think tanks that have different view of what the future holds. I am a person who believes in having preps, and included in that is the skills to survive as long as possible. Being from Oklahoma and the amount of storms and tornado's we have a community is a great thing to believe in; however, if it comes down to people not having something and others having it all good will is out the window. I say be prepared for the inevitable and if you can be able to rely on yourself and family. I am not a LDS, but I do see where a lot of their teachings and principles are a good mind set. Here is hoping and praying to the Good Lord above that we don't have to live through a total melt-down, because what will ensue will not be an orderly government but a true chaos of roving crowds looking for anything they want. Peace is through superior firepower, but when the numbers keep coming you better have a back-up plan besides joining the crowds.

Instead of storing a year's worth of food, wouldn't it be better to already have a small infrastructure (and hopefully community with your neighbors) set up where you know how to save seeds for next years crops and you understand how your chicken coop works so you can have eggs and meat? At least if you have the minimal space these things need.

Food storage in my mind is for an emergency, so maybe a week or two. That said, of course more is better as long as it doesn't make you a target or take too much of your time or space to keep.

As for the 10k rounds, that should be the minimum and for .22LR only. Then you probably should have another 10k of mixed stuff for your other systems if you can

A year's supply is what you'd be eating while waiting for your crops to grow for next year. If you're contributing to a community, food will go a long ways towards making you an important part of it when food runs out for everyone else.

Then my plans for world domination will be nearly complete. Today my community, tomorrow the world! Mua ha ha ha!

Small Steps DT, Small Steps.

1. Your community
2. Your state
3. The United States
4. North America
5. WORLD DOMINATION!

By taking small steps, no one will think you are planning on becoming the King of the World!

10 k for 22 is doable. I want at least 1 k for each other bug out/in platform--9, 45, 223, 12 gauge. Hunting rounds I'll keep 100 or so rounds on hand plus reloading components for 1-2 hundred more. Would like components for 223, 9 and 45, but bullets are hard to come by...

Good thinking Skunk. I'll need minions. Want to apply?

DT, I have a question and Yes, it's none of my business and if you don't want to answer, no problem.

WHAT do you do with all your preps when you have to move?

Sure. I don't mind being a minion, but I don't want to be a peon.

Skunk, I could never peon you

That's really nice of you D/T!

Move it with us or put it in storage. Guns stay with my parents if they'll still let me borrow their basement

Why wouldn't the guns move with you? I guess it could it depend on where you're moving.

OK thanks DT. But I figured with all the food storage you are supposed to have that "They" wouldn't move all that weight. I know when I was in the Air Force we were only allowed so much weight to ship. Anything over that (IF they would let you) you had to pay for and it wasn't cheap.

Depends on where ya go. Not like we need to move furniture with us either

Food storage is mostly meant for a shelter-in-place scenario. However, if you've got to leave, refer to the Bug Out Vehicle post.

I've become a-political and a-survival because everything I read, listened to, and studied supported the conclusion in DT's original post.

As a result, I've just tuned out politics and have been trying to live a clean God fearing back-to-basics life.

Apolitical

The state or quality of being apolitical can be the apathy and/or the antipathy towards all political affiliations.

Asurvival

The state or quality of espousing total apathy toward a survival mindset based upon circumstance or rational decision-making.

I've not been around the boards, because I'm pretty much done with survivalism. I figure if you're living an 1800's lifestyle then you're pretty much surviving anyway. This precludes the need to fear, heed, or otherwise care about other people's opinions, assertions, and/or issues that you cannot effect change over.

Stated differently:

If you live like a frontiersman who cares if XYZ happens? You're insulated from everything short of Nazi Germany style round-up and executions. If our government tries that crap - I suspect there will be a lot of dead jack-booted thugs because every bubba with a shotgun will be taking pot-shots at them.

Lets hope it doesn't come to that - jack-booted thugs.

I think that we can all have a positive influence in the world, including in politics. If good people do nothing, and don't help to prevent stupid laws, then we're stuck with something we don't like or want.

We can all have an influence.
However,I feel that I belong to a vast MINORITY, when it comes to changing the way things are going, here.

Where I come from, people think of me as a complete nutcase, for suggesting that I/we/man should have the right to defend one self with a weapon. All the while gangs from Eastern Europe are just stroling across our borders, ready to loot and rob at gun point.

Therefore, I feel that I have to start from rock bottom in a society that has been completely disarmed and completely dependant on decisions made by career politicians.
MOST Danish politicians haven't even had a day job, ever. They just graduated from lawschool, and then went for a career in politics.

So! You have to start with friends and relatives to get them thinking outside the box of "every day life".

Ok, just a short rant on how people here think differently than I.

"All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent." Thomas Jefferson

I'm well versed.

After years of failed attempts at educating people, personal involvement in politics (including board memberships in political action committees, rallies, speaking engagements, etc), countless books read trying to prepare myself for the "next" debate, etc I came to one harrowing conclusion: most people simply don't care as long as they have sports on TV and beer.

Panem et circenses!

However, I applaud those like yourself that still hold out hope over the crushing weight of our current apathy.

Let's put it this way. There may not be a whole lot we can do about Washington. However, if you help to elect the local sheriff, knowing him to be a God-fearing man who respects the constitution, if/when Washington tells him to confiscate all of the guns in his area, I'd hope he'd "find" none, except perhaps some BB guns (which some may mistake for assault rifles). Or maybe he'll provide Washington a number of weapons "confiscated and destroyed, as instructed."

Jared, there IS a "Movement" if you want to call it that throughout the country, where people vow "OK, it's probably the Rednecks Mostly" to keep GOD, GUTS, and COUNTRY uppermost.

GOD for strength and understand and the knowledge to do what is right.

GUTS To carry out, to actually DO what is correct

COUNTRY to preserve "Our" lifestyle, the Way folks should be toward each other.

Well stated Randy!

Thank you , thank you very much.

I think that as a whole, the American people are a patient lot, often taking MUCH more that we should. BUT when we've had enough, words of the Famous Sailor come to mind. "Enough's enough and enough is TO much! Toot Toot!

Randy,
Don't misintrepret what I'm saying.

My point is that we're living quiet "back to the basics" lives centered around God, family, and farm. Its a simple world view that cuts out main-stream-media, the talking-heads, and every lying sack of excrement that holds an office in the neo-fascist / control freak government.

I, like most liberty minded people, have a line in teh sand. I've made a mature decision about what my line is and what I'll do if anyone crosses it. Suffice to say, they'll find themselves on the wrong side of a well equipped, properly trained, and excessively motivated enemy if any harm ever comes to my family or if they try to take my property.

HOWEVER, I'm done trying to convince people for their need of self-preservation. I'm exhausted from trying to show people how little difference there really is between Demopublicans and Republicrats (as a non-neoconservative Constitutional Libertarian I view virtually everything going on in the state and federal governments as unconstitutional).

My solution is to live simple, keep my head down and be watching vigilantly.

They fear the unknown more than the known. Look at the endless wars in the middle east. Do they have a uniformed military to defeat? No - they have and fear a barely namely, loosely collected, leaderless group of goat farmers. Be like that or be like the rusty nail that sticks up.

You know what happens to the rusty nail that sticks up, don't you? IT GETS HAMMERED DOWN.

You want to know what I think about this entire topic - just look at the "LOC" under my avatar.

We're being watched? What ever gave you that idea.

I for one do not plan to just sit on my a$$ and watch the country I put my life on the line for while in the military and now when I keep the ones that we need the weapons to protect ourselves from locked up (and getting there free cable gyms food and education) go down the tube without a fight.

My new paint job on my 82 chevy diesel.

Man, i like that! I grew thinking that was the way it was. But sadly I don't think the kids coming up these days understand "God, Guts and Country.

Nice paint job!

That looks great!

Arch, I understand where you are coming from. The frustration and everything. I am very thankful for all that you have contributed to this forum and also for the insight, the "Hints" and tips you have given me.

Live your Life Brother as God intended it. Peaceful and happy, harming no one but trying to help others, until they show they are no longer worthy of that help.

As an outsider I cannot fully comprehend how some of you feel
At a very early age, I knew that I was out of step with the majority of my country
I think Canada is the greatest country on earth, and I would expect that you would feel the same about your country

I believe that if you don't think that your country is the greatest then you should either try to move to the country you think is the greatest or work to make your country the greatest

I do my best to improve my country both locally and nationally but in the end I may be tilting windmills like Don Quixote

Bill, at times, "Tilting at Windmills" is a noble cause, even if the population at large doesn't think so.

It takes a dedicated man to stand along. Thank goodness there are people like you in the world.

cbc you are not alone.

i generally try to avoid posting in these sort of threads. not because because I agree or disagree to any great extent but more so because if you don't wholeheartedly agree with some people then you automatically become "the enemy". not so much on this forum but on some forums it seems people actually plan to live out a modern day version of "gangs of new york" or something. and also because my posts get pretty longwinded when I get into pointing out chicken little and that "the sky is falling" has been going on since man could document it. and somehow the world is always worse for the generation that is around to say it. i admit it could be i'm he one thinking the world is flat but i'm just not as quick to usher in the end of our existance as some seem to be. not saying it won't happen but it would really suck for the world to end on my (our) watch. i guess I could find somebody to blame but it all on but I'd rather not go there in the first place.

but don't get me wrong... i like a good world in peril, end of days, zombie flick as much as anybody. I also really appreciate the positive effects that "prepping" seems to be having on our society when comes to dealing with disasters. I personally won't be prepping out of spite or saying "they" are making me do it. i want to do it and i think its wise to make these types of preparations. and at this point I can only blame myself if I am not prepared for the next likely natural (or unlikely manmade) catastrophic event. i like the idea of becoming self reliant and a better candidate for surviving the end of the world even though I doubt it's coming anytime soon. I like the survivalist movement for the entertainment value and the fact that it promotes the basics of living well. I like it so much so that i have been building/planning an outdoors forum that will probably launch in the next month or so. as for the political drama and tin foil hats... it's just not my thing but who am I to say what's what? so I end up just avoiding the topic when it gets into who, why, when, or how the world ends.

I'm prepping but also understand no matter what you do if something goes down your never really going to have enough preps. As to trying to get people to open their eyes. I'm starting to feel like architect in that topic.

Bill, I really like the parts of Canada that I've visited - the western part is nearly indistinguishable from the US. A couple of roommates in college years ago were from BC and Alberta and wished they could be part of the US or at least form their own country, as long as it didn't include the French. I think some of that feeling of distrust of the country's government is common in any country, but they were pretty adamant about it.

I live in Ohio and I still feel like I wanna find a more grass roots place to live

We have a unique situation here in Canada
Historically we had two major political parties federally and a small left wing party
If you didn't count Quebec, the province of Ontario had more seats in parliament then the rest of the country combined

Since 1867 most governments of Canada where of the opinion that what was good for Ontario and Quebec was good for Canada

There has lead to a feeling of alienation among many western Canadians
We also have a situation where the majority of our population lives in the major city centers. This has also lead to a feeling of alienation for rural areas

I have been a proponent of a triple e senate or giving provinces powers more inline with states in the USA
Failing that I am a western separatist

Many Canadians have an inferiority complex, sort of like the plain younger sister of the prom queen (USA)that secretly smiles when something goes wrong for her pretty sister

This can be seen when you look at some of our larger cities
Toronto likes to think of itself as NYC north
Hamilton like Detroit
Vancouver like LA

Just like the petty younger sister, they like to think they are more worldly and not so superficial
When times are good they will snipe about her, but when the shtf they are blood and nothing else matters

It does bother me when I see Canadians talking smack about the USA, just as it bothers me when Americans that know nothing about Canada talk smack about us

I got nothing but love for ya up there. Your country has backed us in several wars and you guys make our ford vehicle parts for us

Here's my 2 cents. I know we are two individual countries, but to my way of thinking, we are really more like one, at least the western parts of Canada make me think that way. Now the Eastern part... Well Cold one is there, I don't think I need to say anything else.

Hahahahaha

Hehe, yeah he'll probably ban me now.

Hey Chris, would it help to say "I'm just kidding"?

I just wish it was easier to go up there living 300 miles from the best sledding areas in the world and not being able to go because I am too cheap to get a passport stinks. lol

I prep because I don't like the way the Government is going not because I don't love my country. I myself believe that the unrest in the people over the way the government is being run has taken a dramatic jump in the past 10 to 15 years. Now whether we can fix it or if it will lead down the road I am worried about remains to be seen, but if it doesn't come to pass I love the outdoors and hunting so all my preps will still come in handy.

^^^^ well said

You don't need a passport to come up here
You just need a passport to get back home

LOL true!!!

Dang! Why couldn't that have been the case when Bill Clinton became a draft dodger during the Vietnam war.

lol that is true Coyote but my wife would be quite upset when I didn't come home, well at least I hope she would be. lol

Do you folks have any favorite TEOTWAWKI fiction? I've read a couple which were pretty good, though I'm not sure how realistic they were.

Patriots by James Wesley rawles

The highlighted section is what got me thinking. There are so many distractions out there. A lot of people have been saying "God fearing" so I'm guessing what I say next won't offend people. It is so important to have a personal relationship with God. That is the MOST IMPORTANT THING. Don't get me wrong, prepping is important. Being a future Public Health professional, everyone should have a BOB and plenty of supplies for disasters, wars, etc. BUT, life is very fragile and can be cut short at any moment. I could die in a car accident tomorrow. So what is important is how I live my life now. Doesn't the Bible say "don't be afraid of the one who can hurt hurt your body, but be afraid of the one who can hurt your soul"? Distractions are part of that. When they take away time from your relationships with God, family, and friends; that is when they are damaging.

I agree. If your not right with god then its all worthless

I
My friend that is part of the problem today
A person of faith should not have to fear that they might offend someone by expressing their faith

I am not a man of faith nor belief however I do respect those of you who are
Each person should feel free to express their beliefs AND allow others to express theirs

If I sit at your table to break bread, I will bow my head with you if saying grace is your custom

If you sit at my table, I will bow my head with you if saying grace is your custom

Well said its not about forcing your views on others but respecting each other.

TROOF!

WELL SAID Bill my Friend, Well said, as always. If more people were like you, this old world would be a MUCH much better place. And I DO wish there were more people like you.

Agreed

I prep because I care.

You're right DT, Prepping isn't ALL about self.

Actually, I prep because it's a tenant of my faith. Imagining WHY I might need those preps for someday is half the fun. It also helps me prepare to be self reliant in ways I hadn't before considered. I CANNOT get bogged down in the Great Political Freakout if I hope to stay sane but I DO need to influence where I can. My wife is starting to get more concerned about the way our nation is going and even beginning to take an interest in the 2nd Amendment. I find that there ARE people out there that haven't made up their minds yet and just don't really THINK about things since the issues just haven't made it on their radar. THOSE are the ones we need to reach to get them thinking.

I believe being prepared is about being able to take care of others

Yup. My food storage is for my family first and my neighbors second.

DT, not being all the familiar with the LDS I am assuming it was John Smith the started the "Prep" part of your faith. It would be nice if more folks ascribed to this, if nothing else.

It would also be nice if we all would/could subscribe to the words/thinking of that great social reformer that said "Can't we all just get along".

At least Rodney King said ONE thing right.

You honour me my friend

Bill, you deserve the Good words. You are a very thoughtful, caring, deep thinking person. The world WOULD be a much kinder place if we were all more like you.

Close Randy. Joseph Smith Self reliance has always been a part of our faith since the get go (by necessity if nothing else) but not sure exactly when home production and a year's supply started to really be stressed as specific issues.

And yes Bill, Randy speaks for all of us

It's always good to be prepared for whatever problems may come your way. Whether or not you believe in possible politically related disasters, you should still be concerned about Nature's own variety of disasters, whether it's tornadoes, hurricanes, floods, fires, ice storms, severe winter or summer weather, etc.

exactly we got a 500 year flood last year that if it had lasted another day would have put the whole town out of water power and most likely food.

It's a form of insurance really. Except when the bills are payed you still have something tangible in your hands.

Like guns, knives, and food

Not to mention personal economic disaster. Unemployment is still around 10 percent in actual terms. If you lose your job it's nice to know you can still be ok for a while until you can get back on your feet...which in today's economy could be easily a year or longer.

The "end of the world" can take on many forms globally, at the national, state, or community level, or individually. Always good to have a backup plan.

Now, stay away from my nuts!!!

Ok, JOSEPH Smith. Sheesh, I was only a few letters off.

Sorry, I knew it was Joseph, but typed John.

No Problem DT. I've got Divers something or other. Little Pockets in my intestines where they could get stuck casing the OTHER bad divers something or other. diversticulitis and diversstickulosis or something like that. SO I'm not supposed to eat nuts.

The squirrels around my place will eat nearly anything. Some call them "tree rats."

That's what Dan calls them. HE HATES SQUIRRELS!

We have a healthy dislike of red squirrels around here they will eat holes in your roof, but grey and fox squirrels are all good and they taste good also.

I thought red squirrels were fox squirrels.

Alrighty then, not worried 'bout Randy. But I got my eyes on the rest of you...

Red squirrel

What we call a fox squirrel (it appears its just a varient of the gray)

THAT ain't no ordinary Squirrel. That's one of them thar Black Debil Squirrels! Theys knock turnall and creep around in the shadows.

how did your Dr. apt turn out Josh?

Black is a genetic variation of the gray. The top is a pine squirrel. Fox is those red ones that get to be almost as big as a ground hog

Mike, you've either got the largest squirrels around or you got some really small Soil Swine.

The fox here are two or three times the size of the grays

Around here the fox (red to us) and grays are pretty much the same size, but the reds are more aggressive.

The foxes are cowards even with their big size

That's probably because they got into the Weed patch!

Lol we are so off topic

our reds/foxs are about half the size of the grays and the blacks seem to run biggest of all.

It has been happening a lot lately lol I dont think anyone minds as long as we get back on topic eventualy

Not really. Squirrels would be a very good food source if it all went to "H E double hocky sticks.

The pine/reds are smaller than the grays

Foxes are canines, not squirrels...what's the matter with you people...sheesh!

We are just trying to confuse you into playing with the foxes then we can split up your gear, darn I spilled the beans.

fox squirrels are big. Shot one with a 44. Size of a small cat.

Hey DT, how did it go at the Doc's?

you ain't eatin' one that's bin shot with a 44 though. Not much of a food source after that...

Had an MRI. I'll have it interpreted on Wednesday. Doc thinks it's torn but still hoping for a strain.

Thanks for the Update! Prayers the Doc's hopes are correct.

Ya shoot 'em in the HEAD! Sheesh.

Let me rephrase: I'M still hoping for a strain

This one was a heart/lung shot. Pretty snazzy shooting with a 44 revolver at 25 yards if I do say so myself

US TOO!

+1

Way to mess up a good meal.

Impressive

Yes, good shot. I guess you weren't just squirrel hunting with a 44 (Mag?). At least, I hope not.

Deer hunting. Got bored.

been there DT.

You were there? So THAT'S why I didn't see any deer! Stay outta my deer woods greaser!

Haha I can't even count how many times my archery pins and slug gun cross hairs have been on squirrels

or how many broadheads I ruined trying to shoot those dang little buggers

but the deer there taste so good.

I'm gonna pee on your tree stand

Squirrel pee might attract more deer.

NOOOOOOOOO!!!!

LOL that 12 pointer I got out of your stand last year was a little tough but I won't complain too much. ;-)

12 point squirrel?

Yep that was the one.

I've heard of jackalopes but not the tree rat version

Clearly you don't spend enough time in the woods.

Haha

GD, you gotta get out more often

You see some interesting stuff in the woods

Nice Rack!

Best looking Deerel I've ever seen!

Evidently they are not in the woods of southern Ohio

I think that they are only indigenous to the backwoods of Virginia and West Virigina. Only seen at night, around places called Stills. I am presuming that means places where the wind doesn't blow as Deerel are VERY Skiddish.

And of course again, the KING of the woods, The Mule Deerel.

Please, call me MISTER Mule Deerel.

Either those are some strange squirrels, or somebody has Photoshop and way too much time on their hands.

Photoshop is an illusion, photoshop does not exist. The pictures are real. Carry on.

Lolololol

Those are great pictures

Great post, but seems that its lost its way so lets bring things back into the crosshairs. The country is screwed, we are all sitting on a tinder box waiting for it to catch fire. When you turn on the news or internet and you have some idiot who can't form a correct sentence (Jeantel: "The Jury, They Old. That's Old School People. We In A New School, Our Generation") or is clueless about real world events, then we are doomed as a moral society.

Actually, I work with a diverse group of people and a couple of them come from the Baltimore area. I often wonder what they would do if the crap ever hit the fan.

Let's hope we never find out.

Just like that crippled doe you put down this AM, there is a segment of society that needs to be...........

lifted up and loved.

Hum.... Guess you folks back East use different words than we do round about these parts.

We all love in our own ways. Some love with hugs and others with a 25-06

The king around here used to be the 30.30.

If we're going levers I like the 45-70. Go big or go home

That REALLY puts a big....love....on a critter

Using a 45.70 on deer around here would be like using slugs on Bunnies! (most of our deer aren't all that big any more.

My dad loves his 25-06 and my brother his .308, but I'm wondering about a .243 for low recoil, ammo availability, and practicing with my kids. I was raised shooing 22lr, and my dad let me shoot his 30-06 as a young teen - it was far too much for me. With the recent ammo shortage, availability makes a big difference. No sense in owning something you can't get rounds for. I hear that .243 is a good whitetail caliber, which is what I'm considering geting for this fall's hunt.

308 600 yards out with a splash of love from a far.

.243 is an excellent long range rifle but of course it has its limits. Go bull go long.

I've heard tell of a lot of folks using the .243 for deer. If you respect it's limitations you should I would think be fine. Would a .270 be to big?

OR even a 7mm-08 (don't know much about it though).

A .270 or 7mm-08 might be fine for me, but I'm thinking about something that I can use to get my kids familiar with centerfire rifles. Also, something I can use for practical purposes - whitetail deer hunting, though I'm looking at a range of about 250 years max.

And related to this topic...something that will be useful at the end of the world as we know it.

The 7mm-08 is a sweet round but a little spendy the upside is I always see it on the shelves.

I really like the 7mm-08 and 7x57 for deer size game

the 243 is a great round. The 25-06 isn't much if any worse than the 243. The 243 is a necked down 308. The 25-06 is a necked down 30-06. If you reload, it's not too bad. any more it seems like 243 ammo is getting just as spendy as 25-06 which I can still find for about $1/round. The 243 with a 90-100 grain bullet is more than capable of killing deer cleanly at 300 yards. 25-06 shoots between 100-120+ bullets. THe bigger 257 bullets will whack a little more than the 100 grain 243 but not too badly. My oldest has been shooting a 243. I'm going to get him on a 30-30 or my 25-06 this year.

If you put 150 grains in the 30-06 it's not too bad. Just stay away from the 180-200 grain bullets

7mm-08 is always in Walmart or Dicks Sporting Goods and is also a perfectly fine deer caliber.

IMO, .270 is a bit much for a younger kid--again, it's a necked down 30-06, but shoots a larger bullet than the 25-06. Bigger the bullet, the harder the recoil.

My 8mm Mauser with a 196 grain bullet can deliver a destructive kick, which is tempered by the weight of the rifle. I believe that it's equivalent to a 30-06. That is one hard-hitting bullet, but I'd rather not put a scope on it as it's original WWII. I'm considering a Stevens 200 or Savage 11 with accu-trigger. Not sure if 25-06 or 243 is a better small caliber rifle for the eastern woodlands.

if you can spend the little extra the accutrigger is more than worth the cash, take a look at the Mossberg 100s with the LBA trigger the same as the accutrigger and a little less money.

I shoot a Stevens 200 in 25-06. Shoots 120 gr bullets nice and accurately. Doesn't come in an accu-trigger--you need to upgrade to the Savage 111 for that. The Stevens was gifted. If I were buying it, I'd have dropped the money on the Savage, but the Stevens is dang accurate even with the stock trigger.

And it's fine for the woods (or cornfields, or meadows, tc.) of VA