Hi Guys,

alot of you know about Bark River or different steels and I have a Bark River Forrester. this is a large blade, 16" overall made out of N685 i read. what is N685? is it related to N690? all i know is that it is an alloy steel? what ever that means. thanks for the input. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/doh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif" alt="" />


I had been working for about an hour on a post with links and info. When I clicked enter, I received the no longer valid message and my post was gone.

I have done this a few times now. If I highlight and copy prior to posting I never loose anything, but if I forget to copy it.... I loose it. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

.

I will try to piece "some" of the info back together and post, but I have to get back to some other stuff.

I've had that happen a few times. very frustrating.

STEEL / Carbon / Cr / Cobalt / Mn / Moly / Sili / Vanadium

N-685 / 0.90 / 17.5 / 0.00 / 0.40 / 1.10 / 0.45 / 0.10
N-690 / 1.07 / 17.3 / 1.50 / 0.40 / 1.10 / 0.40 / 0.10

N-685 and N-690 are both made Bohler. Bohler is an Austrian company. Their steels are apparently highly refined and expensive.

See: Bohler - N-685

Some people tend to compare N-685 to 440-B.
And compare N-690 to 440-C.
Some people tend to compare N-690 to VG-10.

I don't know as much about N-685 and how it compares to 440-B, but N-690 does seem to compare more to VG-10 than 440-C to me. VG-10 and N-690 both have cobalt and vanadium. 440-C doesn't.
With the exception of the added cobalt in N-690, N-685 and N-690 are pretty close. But, I am sure the addition of cobalt changes the steel.

Although, ultimately, how a knife performs in use depends on the refinement of the steel and the heat treatment. Bohler is known for highly refined steel and Mike Stewart is known for quality heat treatment.

That said, truthfully, I am not sure I understand why Mike used N-685. N-685 may be very tough for a stainless steel, but Mike has always seemed to pretty strongly believe that no stainless steel is as tough as a good high carbon steel. N-685 is clearly a stainless steel. Still, I am sure Mike took significant care in making the most of N-685 and making it as tough as possible. I believe the additions of Silica, Cobalt and Vanadium all add to toughness.

Some people are always wanting stainless, so he may have just tried to offer the toughest stainless he could find. I don't honestly know if N-685 is the toughest stainless out there, but it is probably high on the list.

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Here are some quotes from Mike Stewart about his N-685:

- "forged N685 Bolher Stainless steel -- Triple tempered--Cryo treated--"

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- N685 is a very pure -- remelted to remove any impurities -- High Carbon Stainless.
It is very close in formula to 440B but is fine grained like A-2 and 12C27.
It is expensive and not commonly available here in the states.

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- "In my chopping tests--it is a very serious performer. I have not chopped any soft woods yet but it flys through hard woods.
I realize this is far less than conventional but we have never been known to be conventional." ..... I don't know if he was referring to steel or blade design when he mentioned "less than conventional"

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- "If we wanted to use Stainless on a large--heavy knife--12C27 is out.--Sandvick does not roll it over .187" thick.

If you look at the Forester we are about to come out with--We used Bolher N685 because we can't get the 12C27 in the needed Thickness. The Forester is .275" thick. That fine German steel is more like 440B. More lateral strength than 440C."



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Here are some other links to threads discussing N-685 and similar:

Bladeforums - Cliff Stamp comments

General Steel Info - .... some light reading....

Bladeforum post


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Ultimately, there isn't a whole lot of info out there about N-685 or even much about N-690 which is much more commonly used.
From what I can tell, they both seem to be quality stainless steels.

I don't personally have the Forrester. It has always been a curious design to me. At one time a few years ago, I had a Boker Smatchete. It was kind of an interesting knife, but I never used it. It never stuck me a a chopper and it always seemed sort of awkward. The Forrester has some significant differences over the Smatchete and the edge seems more suited for chopping than the Smatchete.

I would be interested in hearing your unbiased thoughts and review of the knife.

.

I'd be curious too Scrappy. I saw a good deal on one of these a coupla weeks ago and I almost pulled the trigger on it but didn't. I was thinking I would rather just buy a cheap chopper and maybe a smaller camp knife (ended up getting the Ratmandu!). I'd appreciate it if you'd post your observations on that knife (and maybe a few pics).

will do. i might buy a second one in micarta first though

knife guy,
thanks for the information

Can someone post a pic?
I much prefer a good tool or spring steel to stainless except when you need stainless for a certain application. The swedish scandi knives are usually stainless because their coastal climate incurs rust. One of my favourite Stainless knives is the CR SEAL knife which really needs to be stainless for underwater use.
This stainless we are discussing sounds pretty cool especially if it is like 440C with more Vanadium and other alloys. Remember though 440C has a LOT of cromium.

Here are some pics of the Bark River - Forrester:









And here is a review I found:

Bark River - Aurora, Forrester and PSK review @ JerzeeDevil-forum

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Regardless of the steel, Mike usually tests his blades pretty hard before releasing them.

I still have mixed feelings about the design and I am curious to hear other peoples feedback on the knife.

But, I do feel that there are a few of these knives to be had at a very low price right now and I believe these knives will be worth more in the future.

I think I mentioned on a previous thread that the Northwinds went down to as low as $125 - $150 at one time, but now people are willing to pay $275 - $300. I wish I had another Northwind.

But, I still really like my Golok and Mike is about to release more Goloks.



.... of course that Cold Steel Barong that Vic showed looks pretty nice and for aboout $20 - $25 !!!!

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Welcome to the Yard

Dumpster Dan