That's a neat rant, Tyger, but at this point there is little to no scientific evidence that dark matter would give us any sort of "power". It's more about confirming or refuting some ideas about why the universe is expanding at the rate it is.

Unfortunately, the idea of dark matter holding any kind of mystical powers is mostly a science fiction idea, right up there with tachyon beams and photon torpedoes.

I haven't hung around with any cosmologists in five or six years, but the last time I was involved in a deep discussion of dark matter, one of the prevailing theories was that a large quantity of dark matter in the universe was comprised of neutrinos. Neutrinos are a particle that interact so weakly with the world around them that they can pass straight through the Earth. In fact, in the course of reading this thread, hundreds of neutrinos have passed through your body. For many years, neutrinos were thought to be completely massless, like photons, but as of five years ago, several experiments had shown promising results that indicated neutrinos might have just a tiny bit of mass. Since there are SO MANY neutrinos in the universe, even a ridiculously small amount of mass could potentially explain a huge amount of dark matter.


At the end of the day, beyond any mystical ideas or sci-fi voodoo, the term "dark matter" means exactly what it sounds like - matter that we don't see. It could take the form of some exotic particle we have yet to detect, or it could be simple objects that don't reflect or produce light well enough for us to see them. The evidence for the former is starting to outweigh the evidence in favor of the latter, but that distinction is exactly what these sorts of "raccoon city" experiments are trying to determine. Either way, it's HIGHLY unlikely that an understanding of dark matter will give us any power over creation, or even any more power than we already know we can harness from nuclear energy.

I better warn Boss Hog that research is being directed at his heat treat process...those sneaky gov agents. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif" alt="" /> LOL

Any idea what dark matter can be used for or is that what the lab is for?


Dan

There's not much use for dark matter - this kind of stuff is strictly in the realm of big-picture cosmology, astronomy, and fundamental physics research - mars rovers, telescopes, the sloan digital sky survey, the Large Hadron Collider.... none of these things are expected to produce some new material that will make life better, but they are hoping to expand our understanding of the universe.


Then again, sometimes you get a lot of practical stuff by accident along the way in the pursuit of "pure science". Think about all of the good stuff that came out of the space program - computer technology, velcro, Tang, dried ice cream <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Heck, the World Wide Web and web browsers were invented at CERN, which was a particle physics lab that was doing research into fundamental particles, not because they thought they could find an industrial use for Quarks and Gluons, but because they wanted to understand the universe a little bit better.

Those are really good thoughts. I just saw a show this week that discussed the big bang theroy...not the sit comm. and I was amazed at how the theroy has morphed or expaned from when I was in college. They stated a lot of the newer understanding came from the research that Dr. Huble did in the 50s and scientist have been building on that work...interesting

Dan

Never meant to make it sound like a rant, just an observation of our history as a race. And believe me, I'm not one to think of dark matter as some "mystical power"; so let's leave that one in the fantasy section. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

My statement wasn't so much directed at the "unknown power" of dark matter, so much as the "unknown uses" that we, as a culture, would put the knowledge of dark matter to. My apologies if I mislead you in that.

As we discover more and more of our world and the universe around us, we continue to advance, both scientifically and technologically. Sadly, the staggering progress we achieve in these two areas far exceed our slow progress in such areas as: morality, responsibility, conscious, unity, compassion, empathy, respect.... I could go on, but I'm hoping you get my point.

As individuals, we can be seen to have these attributes; but put a large number of us together, and you see these disappear and become: ruthlessness, self-caring, rudeness, antagonism, greed, ignorance and so many other negative attributes so well displayed by those who live in large population cities.

I'm sure when the atom was first proven to exist, the farthest thing from their minds was," I really hope we can use this to make the most powerful bomb ever seen!" <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> They merely wanted to prove that it was there, nothing more. But look what that turned into. Sure, good things have come out of that discovery, but so have an equivalent number of bad things.

If Dark Matter is proven to exist, what lays down the road for the human race? What potential uses could we put such knowledge to?

Not trying to sound like a pessimist; just someone who is hesitant to see our race jump ahead light years when we haven't handled sublight speed....Sorry, couldn't resist the light-hearted Star Trek joke! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

But how to use dark matter in a knife blade.

The most recent studies of the makeup of the cosmos suggest to us that only 4% of the cosmos is made up of ordinary matter; 26% is made up of what is called exotic dark matter, and 70% of what is called dark energy (see Scientific American, January, 2001, pages 37-53).
http://www.doesgodexist.org/MarApr02/MakingGodHuman.html

WHAT IS THE COSMOS MADE OF?
The changes that have taken place in our understanding of the makeup of the cosmos is incredible. When I graduated from college in 1959, the cosmos was made up of atoms and parts of atoms that were observable in the laboratory. Binding energy particles like neutrinos had been mathematically predicted, but really not observed. In the 1980s it became obvious that there was matter in the cosmos that had not been observed, but which held the cosmos together. Called dark matter, this material's nature still is debated, but it is obvious that it exists in some form. In 1998 it became apparent that the cosmos is accelerating in its motion; and within the past three years experimental evidence does not leave any doubt that this is in fact happening. The Space Telescope Science Institute has just released this picture of the cosmos:

.03% Heavy Elements--elements created by nuclear fusion that we and our planet are made of.
.3% Neutrinos--particles with very small masses that permeate space.
.5%` Stars--gaseous balls ignited by gravitational pressure, producing nuclear fusion.
4% Free hydrogen and helium--gas floating in interstellar space.
30% Dark Matter--unseen matter that holds the cosmos together.
65% Dark Energy--undetermined force of the cosmos that expands and accelerates the cosmos

We would suggest that this picture speaks highly of the complexity of the cosmos, a complexity that denies chance and speaks highly of how special a place we live in.

--Reference: USA Today, June 4, 2001, page 7D
http://doesgodexist.org/SepOct01/NewsNotes.html

Ghost Galaxies.
When discussing the evidence that the Creation did not happen by chance, one area that has enormous bearing is how many conditions in space have to be exactly right. An excellent example of this is the fact that not all galaxies are the same. Our galaxy is a spiral type b galaxy. What that means is that our galaxy has arms wound with medium tightness and has enormous amounts of interstellar matter--lots of material to make planets out of.

The most abundant kind of galaxy in space is the elliptical galaxy. Over 80% of all galaxies in space are elliptical galaxies--but elliptical galaxies have very little interstellar material! There is nothing to make a planet out of in an elliptical galaxy. We would not look for life in a place like that.

New studies by astronomers have shown a new type of galaxy called a ghost galaxy. These galaxies contain few, if any, stars at all. They seem to be made up of dark matter and perhaps a few dim stars. These objects are smaller than our Milky Way, but they show that conditions for a planet that can sustain life are even more difficult than man has previously understood. (Reference: Science News, Vol. 155, January 30, 1999, page 79.)
http://www.doesgodexist.org/JulAug99/NewsNotes.html

New Understandings of the composition of the cosmos.
New tools of astronomy have given mankind a much better picture of the cosmos in which we live. These devices measure things that cannot be seen by the naked eye and tell us more about how the cosmos holds together. Our direct observation of ordinary matter called baryonic matter such as protons and electrons shows us that it makes up only 5% of the mass of the universe. The number of particles of this form of matter is consistently being measured at 1078 (or one with 78 zeros after it). Microwave telescope observations are telling us that .005% of the cosmos is made up of radiation by mass, and neutrinos are being measured to make up .3%. Cold dark matter that holds galaxies together makes up 25% of the mass of the cosmos, but scientists are unsure what it is made up of. The acceleration of the expansion of the cosmos tells us that dark energy makes up 70% of the cosmos, and extensive research is going on to see what the nature of this energy is. All of this is showing that much of what we have understood about the makeup of the cosmos was greatly oversimplified, and the design features that allow it to exist are even larger than we imagined.

--Reference: Scientific American, March 2003, page 48-59.
http://www.doesgodexist.org/MayJun03/NewsNotes.html

WoW...We could start our own THINK TANK....Who said we were all dumb mutts.

I'm not all that smart, still having problems dealing with Quarks <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif" alt="" />. The internet and web browsers were invented at CERN? I thought Al Gore invented it. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

No, the internet was invented by the US Department of Defense. The world wide web was invented at CERN. Big difference. You can do more on the internet than what happens in firefox or internet explorer, ya know <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Neutrinos have mass? Next you’ll be telling me that tachyons have class. (Sorry. Even I know that’s a dreadful pun.)

I suspect that dark matter is our current name for “We don’t have a clue.” I’m no physicist, but Eddington was. “Not only is the universe stranger than we imagine, it is stranger than we can imagine.” Nobody really gets what things are like on quantum levels, but we can describe some of them in mathematical language. The same is true in astrophysics. The paradoxes of relativity, the strangeness of black holes, are really beyond the ken of our everyday minds. But at least mathematically, physicists have some handle on them.

Not so dark matter. We are at the stage of searching a coal cellar at midnight for a black cat that isn’t there. Which is why I suspect that once we do get a few clues to whatever dark matter really is, it will make the world of quarks and quantum entanglement look as sensible as baseball.

I thought Al Gore invented the AlGorithm used to calculate the price of carbon credits. Dark matter may be what mystics call spirit. It has some mass, about 23 grams per person on average. I got all this from the National Inquirer.