ZX, Never heard of that one, I will have to check it out.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Republic_%28Plato%29

Download it for free here (it went out of copyright a couple of thousand years ago <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> ) : http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/1497

I think what's frightening about 'The Republic' is that Plato wrote this in 380BC... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif" alt="" />

Here's transcripts of a guy who is really clued about what is going on...

The big boys at the top truly understand this. And rather than have revolutions every 4 or 5 years, as they used to sometimes have sporadically in different places across Europe in the days of feudalism, they decided to give us this thing called democracy and pretend that we won it ourselves. It was very, very good because it stopped people revolting every 5 years or so. And what you do in democracy is you always vote the last party out, you’re so sick of them. And that’s all you’re really doing. You’re not really voting a new one in, you just want rid of the last bunch and you hope, you know, the simple people hope that these ones will somehow remedy all the problems. Then you find out, my God they’re just as bad as the last lot. And it doesn’t matter if it’s called left wing or right wing, as I say; the two wings are attached to the same bird, this thing called democracy. The real body that runs it is always behind the shield; that’s why they’ve always got a shield in front, so you don’t really see who’s pulling the strings for both of the wings.

That’s the system that you live in. It’s very simple. It’s worked awfully well. And there’s never been such a thing as democracy. Never, ever been such a thing as democracy. And try to find even a stable definition of it; it doesn’t exist. Because it’s elastic; it keeps stretching every few years with more and more things added to it. And it’s never stable, therefore you cannot have a stable life. That’s obvious. No generation has had peace since democracy was invented. You’re either in a financial crash with massive debts to pay off because the bankers plunder you... The bankers do this at least twice a century; that’s their history. In the 1800s they did it a few times more, because they had more leeway. Even in the late 1870s, 3 men in the US crashed the economy 3 times towards the late 1800s. Everyone knew who they were; it was published in the papers, which these guys owned. And they got away with it too; they plundered pensions and everything.

And the laws are never changed after crashes to prevent it happening again. Because you see, it’s the banker’s system. I mean the big international banker system that runs the world. It’s always been that way. Money runs the whole world. Money, as the old song goes, money makes the world go around. And it’s their world. And if you understand it, there are people who have been around for thousands of years who have done nothing but lend money and figure out economies of whole countries and how they could get more and more profit off those countries, and how they could use those countries in times of debt, when the countries owed money to the bankers, make deals with them and get them to invade other countries. That’s how empires were built. They just simply collected countries in debt and then had the armies go off and fight to standardize the world. In the ancient times even the Phoenicians did this too. They had a silver standard; silver was the first currency when it was eventually minted around 800BC. They wanted a certain weight of it and they tried to standardize it across the ancient world by different means, some of them very tricky and also by war, by the way.

Getting back to the taxes, it’s incredible when you tally all of the taxes up. Local and provincial or state taxes and then federal taxes and now we’ve got international taxes to the United Nations too, through various means. Now they’re even taxing the air we breathe, under this guise of carbon taxes and stuff like that. I mean, it goes on and on and we accept it like the fools that we are. We moo to each other like good cattle complaining the grass is a bit tough to chew, but we carry on chewing the cud regardless. Pretty disgusting isn’t it? But that’s what you’re reduced to. And as I say, every country now has to bring in the Value Added Tax. That is the agenda. The guys who gave you this new world order, which was the Royal Institute of International Affairs, made up of bankers, international bankers, that also have a branch in the US called Council on Foreign Relations, they said in their early writings they’d have to bring in a form of Value Added Tax across the globe, under different guises. It doesn’t matter what name they give it in your country, it’s the same thing. It’s a tax on everything that you purchase. And it’s a tax even on your electricity bill; it’s a tax on everything. Value Added Tax. And you get nothing back from it whatsoever.

http://cuttingthroughthematrix.com/trans...July062011.html

Here's the link to more of his articles...

http://cuttingthroughthematrix.com/transcripts_Alan_Watt.html

You bring up a good point zuluX, about money running the world, this is definitely true. This whole current crisis has been started by businesses who wanted an excuse to outsource and lay off (IMHO). Very few companies are honorable (like Busse) and will try to keep the work force local to where they sell their products, thus not ruining their main customers for a quick profit.

Charging interest on a loan was illegal almost everywhere until 1694, and is considered a sin in the bible.

From "http://www.larryhannigan.com/EarthPlus.htm" (Everyone should read the entire story, its a dumbed down version of how money as we know them came about):


The only real democracy is a direct democracy where the entire population is informed of subjects and everyone gets to vote on everything. The closest thing I know of is Switzerland.

Hey Monsterdog, so very true what you mention about debt... You know we are part of a system that has been manufactured to enslave us through debt. As long as you have a society that is enslaved by debt then you have them where you want them, you can control them and stop them from 'getting out of hand'. Also 'they' keep moving the goal posts and you just never seem to get on top of it. 'They' make up all sorts of reasons to justify increases on everything from food to clothes blaming it on everything else except their psychopathic lust for money.

The sad part is that very few people actually know that charging interest on debt is NOT condoned by any religion except the New Age religion of [email]Cr@pitalism[/email], oops sorry I mean Capitalism. That's all this current system of Democracy is, it's a guise for [email]Cr@pitalism.[/email]

I think it was Roosevelt who was in the process of clamping down on the modern system of banking and the charging of interest on debt when he died. Imagine how life would have been if he'd have succeeded.

If a man is truly free he doesn't have to be constantly reminded that he is.

Well I am a political science junkie. I talk about sex, religion, politics and current events at bars. I have a very tolerant view of these kinds of threads as long as all posters are respectful of one another and not deliberately antagonistic. I have my own views about DHS. I tend to be rather libertarian, so you can guess what they are. Let's treat each other as brothers in the yard, regardless of our differences, and see where this thread wanders off to. I'll be watching! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Being able to share information and have a descent discussion is what it's all about. I also think that there are times certain statements could be taken as personal attacks and that's where the line gets blurred, glad to know you'll be keeping an eye on us, thanks... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Dan has I think Indicated he does not want this site turn into a political debating site. I personally do not think the above posts do this, just a stating of facts, or how someone views some "Writings".

I for one thank Dan for allowing intelligent, adult, NON ABUSIVE discussion. This helps foster a sense of "Brotherhood" to us here in the yard. Thank You Dan, and Thank you Vic.

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" />

I found that article to be downright misleading and inflammatory. I'm not a fan of big brother watching over, but a lot of this seems a bit sensationalized.

Just so many things on that article are twisted by a writer that counts on the readers not bothering to look at original sources and do any additional research.

The link to "DHS internal documents" links to Missouri state documents. Then they refer to those as "secret" when they are clearly marked unclassified/law enforcement sensitive.

Sorry, but the fact is that there have been more home-grown terrorist incidents than foreign extremists. The watches for those groups are nothing new and nothing specific to DHS.

Lastly, DHS has the weakest LE presence of all the federal depts. A few hundred FPS to protect federal property, Customs/Border Patrol, and some Secret Service that are focused on the President. No secret DHS agents, no intel operatives. They are policy makers, planers, and researchers. A majority of that focused on disaster response(FEMA) and transportation security(TSA). They are incapable of doing what people accuse them of even if they wanted to.

WRX, I'm not sure what the documents you are referring to actually are, but we here at the Sheriff's office get a lot of documents that are marked for law enforcement, not for dissemination to the "Public" and are also marked sensitive. They're not SECRET, but more folks would understand that marking so maybe it was just used to indicate RESTRICTED dissemination.

But as I said, I am not really sure and am just operating on speculation.