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Re: more fire fun! [Re: Momaw] #250125 10/29/08 10:06 PM
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eatingmuchface Offline
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I'm using the bow drill method.
I'd really like to try a different spindle.
it seems my spindle burns more than my baseboard.

I'm using cedar bark and cattails for tinder.
I just can't get a burning ember.
I try to conserve my energy as much as possible, but even when I do I never have enough in the end and I loose my concentration and the the spindle either ends up flinging out or I just can't stand the pain anymore.

I'm on medication daily and I don't eat or drink all day so I think it's also contributing to the muscle cramps I've been getting from it.
normally my back cramps and sometimes my fingers start twitching and cramping.

I wonder if I just went REALLY slow for a lonnnng time if I could get an ember?
a hand drill works like that right?

the bow was the hardest part for me BTW.
I had to figure out a way to make it so that I could tighten the string when it loosens.

it's def. been fun.
I think I'm going to get an ember soon if I keep trying.

maybe I should take some pics?


JYD number 52.
Re: more fire fun! [Re: eatingmuchface] #250126 10/29/08 11:54 PM
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CloaknDagger Offline
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Good going EMF! Like you, I tried FOREVER before i got my first friction fire. A lot of it is making sure your set-up is good. You're right to be using cedar, but I only use it for my base-board. It seems to be pretty soft stuff and won't grind down your spindle too much. In my experience, the key is to make sure that you spindle is harder than your base-board.

Like you, i inadvertently turned my spindle into a projectile countless times before I got the technique down. The solution, I've found, is to make sure your block-piece that holds it down has a nice, deep hole bored in it. If there is a deep pit in your block, your spindle ain't go'en nowheres. I tried all different varieties of wood, but that never really worked out for me. My current block is a big hunk of Douglas Fir bark. Initially, the spindle tore through the block and it looked as through it would drill all the way through. Once the top end of the spindle and the block became smoothed, however, the drilling stopped and the bark seems to be holding up pretty well. I'm not sure if you can get thick, coniferous tree bark in your area, but its worth mentioning. I've also heard that soap-stone and limpet shells work.

In terms of endurance, i wouldn't worry. Basically, this is the conventional wisdom: if it takes you such a long time that you tire out, you're probably doing something wrong (as I was). You can potentially get a coal in no time at all, and skilled users can get a coal in under 20 seconds (I'm probably not to that point yet). So if you go for say, a minute, and you've got no coal, then something isn't quite right. Lets say to go for a minute: you spindle is still in place, you've been working hard, but still no coal? Its probably a question of selection the right woods, and also making sure your kit is made correctly.

Once you think you've got a good kit, and you really want to master it, make yourself a little schedule. Every day, or every other day, or once a week (depending on how much time you have), go out and give it a shot say, 5-10 times. I know from personal experience that slaving away at it for an hour can leave simply angry and annoyed, which generally means that it'll be a long time before you try again. That why, even through I've known how to do it for two years now, I got my first coal only last summer. Rather than practicing in fits and starts, I'd recommend you put in a little time, consistently. Good luck!

here is a video from a site i like, though I think his spindle is too thick.

http://blip.tv/file/367153


P.S. Implume: cool story! thats hilarious


Have you hugged your camp knife today?
Re: more fire fun! [Re: CloaknDagger] #250127 10/30/08 01:26 AM
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eatingmuchface Offline
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Cloak: exactly what I was thinking!
My cedar spindle grind down too easy.

idk what to use for a spindle though and I know it CAN be done with a cedar spindle and base.

my spindle doesn't really go flying anymore...
it's more like... I lose concentrations and I don't apply pressure and the bottom slips out and the spindle unwraps from the string.

I have a good handhold now.

my bow is VERY sloppy looking.
but it feels good in my hand so I'm fine with it.

actually... surprisingly, I ENJOY going out and practicing.
I don't find myself getting frustrated because I get closer every time I go out.
I actually feel pretty accomplished.

I might try a different spindle if this one doesn't work out.

thanks for the advice.
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />


JYD number 52.
Re: more fire fun! [Re: eatingmuchface] #250128 10/30/08 04:50 AM
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CloaknDagger Offline
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Quote
actually... surprisingly, I ENJOY going out and practicing.
I don't find myself getting frustrated because I get closer every time I go out.
I actually feel pretty accomplished.

Man, thats impressive. Good for you, I would always get super annoyed when I slave away at bow drilling and it doesn't work out. Part of it had to do with the spindle getting launched. Somehow, it always seemed to go like this:

1: spindle slips
2: Super-hot end flies into my arm, burning me
3: Spindle ricochets off my arm and soars out of reach

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif" alt="" />

Once I got past those issues through, its a lot more fun. Another tip, which you may already be doing, is to start with cotton balls as tinder. Sure, its kinda cheating, but I find it helpful to break these things down into smaller evolutions. First, get it with cotton, then bump up to other stuff. I tuck my tinder underneath the fireboard itself, to eliminate the potential for loosing the coal as you transfer it to the tinder bundle. This way, the tinder builds up on the cotton and is already in place when its ready. Its takes some getting used to, but it helped me when I was getting started. Keep at it! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" />


Have you hugged your camp knife today?
Re: more fire fun! [Re: CloaknDagger] #250129 10/30/08 10:10 AM
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Momaw Offline
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Quote

Part of it had to do with the spindle getting launched.

See if this helps you out at all. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
http://momaw.kikaimegami.com/bowdrill-tips/

Re: more fire fun! [Re: Momaw] #250130 10/30/08 07:45 PM
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eatingmuchface Offline
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thats a cool idea momaw.

I just tried with a different (seemingly harder) spindle.
but had no luck.

it's pretty rough because I was in a hurry, but it made a lot of smoke already and burnt a deep hole in my board.
I'll keep trying with it for a little.

I think it MIGHT be some kind of locusts.
idk though.

another thing I noticed by looking at other vids is that my bow is actually pretty big.
it has a weird balance and shape too.

I feel comfortable with it though so I'll keep it for now. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />


JYD number 52.
Re: more fire fun! [Re: eatingmuchface] #250131 10/30/08 11:46 PM
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Momaw Offline
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You want soft woods not hard. In order to get fire you need an ember to form in the shredded fluff you make, and when you spin hard woods, they polish and glaze rather than disintegrate.

Re: more fire fun! [Re: Momaw] #250132 10/31/08 04:39 PM
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eatingmuchface Offline
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hmmm. interesting momaw.

I thought if the spindle was harder it would make more dust from the baseboard to form an ember.
I thought the spindle should be harder.
I thought my cedar spindle may be too soft.
idk.

I'll try some more and see.


JYD number 52.
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