I really like the BCM RECCE-16 rifle and the Daniel Defence rifles like it but there are several things I don't like and I can't find any company that makes exactly what I want. I have never built an AR so I am not sure where to begin.

I want a 16 or 18 inch heavy or government profile barrel with a 1-7 or 1-8 twist. I would like it to be sub 1.5 MOA with a normal quality ammo. I want either stainless or chrome lined to help with ease of maintainence. I would like mid or rifle length gas system

I want either a monolithic or free floating quad rail mid or rifle lenght hand gaurd to help with accuracy.
I don't want a front sight tower. I want folding BUIS.

I really like magpul stocks and grips

I don't like how the standard buffer tube weight seems to rattle when firing so I am looking at a product from JP Enterprises. It looks like they also sell some nice barrels.
I was thinking of a LMT bolt carrier(JP barrels come with a bolt).
I have started to save to buy or build but not sure what to do...
Do I buy a built rifle and add a few things... Or do I build what I want from the ground up???

And where do you start when you build an AR?

The rifle idea I want is similar to the navy seal RECCE or army DMR rifle.
It must have a collapsible stock.

You start with a quality lower receiver and build from there. There is plenty of info on the AR forums about lowers and which ones to stay away from. After that it is one piece at a time until you have the AR you want.

^^This.......good quality lower and put what you want on it. They are easy to build.

any ideas as to which companies lower is the best quality to price. maybe colt. bcm. i am not surewhich company to go with to acheive the best fit between the upper and lower.

A freind of mine went with a Yankee Hill when he was building his AR and it turned out great. There are only about 4 companies that actually make lowers and then resell them to the others who put their names on them. I'll try and get you a list of the parts he used along with the prices he paid so you can get an idea of the cost you are looking at.

Got the list. OK to email it to you?

email away my friend. i want to have a tight fit between the upper amd lower because when i am done i am hoping that with match ammo i can get one moa groups or better. it looks like may of the military and match shooters are using a one in eight twist for the best groups with a wide range of ammo weights. i like the lmt socom stock or a similar magpul stock. do you know anything about the two different gas tube sizes. it looks like there is a point seven five zero or point nine three five dia option.

Parts list sent.

Haven't seen anything about different size tubes but I'll see what I can find out.

i wonder if i should use a flash hider a muzzle brake or a hybrid set up

looks like surefire and aac smith enterprises have some nice flash hiders. jp has a nice comp for their barrels.

Take a look at the second issue of Recoil magazine. It's out now. There is Muzzle Device Buyer's Guide in this issue. It explains the differences between flash suppressors, muzzle brakes, compensators, and hybrids along with a price list for each one.

Hobbes56, can you email that list to me as well?

On it's way.

This is something that I've been interested in doing, too. I't's nice to get some opinions from people you trust.

I was thinking of starting with a billet lower since they can be had for not much more than a forged one. Any thoughts on this?

I would prefer billet over forged. They are machined to a tighter tolerance therefore a better fit. The advantage to forged is that they tend to be stronger - good for battle rifles. It all depends what you are going to be using it for. Just my opinion.

Thanks for the email

wow the more i dig the more info i have to sort through. options are every where like chrome lined or stainless barrel. chromed or stainless bolt and carier. i think i want to get the barrel with the gas tube and block so i dont have to worry tuning the ga system. voltor has a upper that might work well the more i read it seems the one in eight twist is what i want it looks like i will be spending about twelve to fifteen hundred buck to make the rifle i want... then optics this is going to get pricy.

It all depends on what type of AR you are looking to build. Do you want something just to shoot and have fun with or are you looking for something for more serious use?

GD, et al,

Decide what your requirements first. DMR or SPR...two different beasts. You cannot rifle gas a 16" barrel, for example. (i mean, you can..but you shouldn't) Your requirements will drive the build.

Also...I would not concern myself with "slop" between the receivers. However, if you remain concerned...do as Hobbes recommended and go Billet. I prefer not to use Billet...but I have different requirements than you. I also do not concern myself with any movement between the receivers as it does not tend to affect accuracy.

Once you have your requirements...I'd recommend building the lower (or buying one assembled), and buying a separate upper of your choice that fits your needs. A good built lower would be a BCM...if you want billet, go with LaRue (yay, Texas!). Check out LaRue's DMR uppers (if that is what you want)....also Noveske. Both are well known for the accuracy of their barrels. If you're ok with a slightly less "known" on the barrel side...try BCM...they are the SYKCO of AR's in my book (price to performance).

If you really want an SPR...forget about all the brakes / comps / etc. Get an Ops Inc brake / collar...and get ready to file a Form 4 for your 12th Model suppressor <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" />

Also...whatever you do...splurge for a Gieselle SSA (or better) trigger group. Your AR will only be as accurate as you can shoot it, and the standard triggers pail in comparison to the Gieselles.

I have to say BCM has begun to dominate the battle market rifle. They are one of the better/best reasobably price AR's on the market. They are one I would take if I needed to bet my life on a rifle.

I just finished building a lower and I am saving my pennies for a nice upper.

The real bonus to build your own is less of saving money and more of getting what you want in the first place and thats where any savings come in. I have the advantage of having run through several different evloutions of Ar and accessories and on this build I know what I like and what I don't.

I have all the lower components that I want. I am leaning towards a LaRue upper. I'll need to save some more pennies.

Thank you, gun dog, for starting this thread.

And thank you, hobbes56/MonkeyBomb/Ishikawa, for all of the great information.

I see much more overtime in my future.

I have some ideas now, but of course nothing is set in stone. I do have a better idea of where to start and which direction to go. Thanks again.

You don't have to go all out with your first one. You can always build a basic version and then either modify from there or build a second one. You are allowed to have more than one. Let me warn you though - it can be as addictive as Busse-kin.

i am looking into if i want to build or buy a complete lower. i am going to buy a sixteen or eighteen inch barrel with the gas block and tube installed. i am going with either a magpul orlmt sopmod stock. i am looking into building or buyimg a upper. but i do ike the build option. the d i get a chromed bolt and carrier or stainless. jp enterprises has some interestimg options. for parts. my goal is a sub moa carbine with a quality triger. a floating handguard folding buis and a sixteen or eighteen inch floating barrel with a one in eight twist. take a good look at the RECCE rifle concept to get aidea of what i want. a fixed stock twenty inch barrel spr is not it. i want a great varmet rifle that is easy to carry ubber reliable and zombie ready.

Saw a couple of pictures. Very cool. Any thoughts on color?

This is my walking varmiter. Armalite lower, CMMG upper (fits perfect) 18" JP ultralight match barrel in .223 Wylde, and finned aluminum heat sink, Carbon fiber free float tube.Young Manufacturing N.M. bolt and carrier,two stage match trigger,YHM BUIS,Magpull and Burris 1-4x24 Fullfield tac 30.
Not exactly mil-spec. but shoots great!

i really like the jp barrel how does she group. also is the heat sink affective. i want to finish my rifle in a federal dark earth color. that color of brown or tan blends in year around in ohio. i am wondering if the jp low mass bolt and recoil buffer are relaible enough for a zombie rifle. sounds like it would be great for lonrange critters. i am thinking that i might like the stainless bolt carrier. it seem that people online have had the chrome come off the carrier . i am trying to figure out what lower i want to use. the hand guard must free gloat but i am tryimg to decide if i want a railed tube or a smooth one you can put rails on. that is a nice set up man.

Looks great. Could you tell me the brand for the float tube?

What brand us the OD green finish?

Doubt any. It's likely a second hand finish, ie: gunkote, cerakote, etc.

A couple more thoughts based on your comments GD...

I am familiar with RECCE configurations. What is confusing, is the idea of mixing a varmint rifle with a zombie ready carbine. I suppose a RECCE is as close as you can get. However, if I was varmint hunting, I would want a higher power scope and probably an 18" barrel...just for a bit more velocity. Not that RECCE can't do it, it's just disadvantaged slightly. Same goes for Zombies. For CQB / HD / SHTF...I want an 11-12" barrel rifle with a RDO on it, and BUIS as desired.

I wouldn't worry about a slick BCG (chrome, NiB, etc). Phosphate works fine.

SPR's are 18", not 20. Recce are 16".

Is there a reason you want 1/8" twist? Why not 1/7"? Just curious.

Collapsible stocks...I really like the LMT SOPMOD. Also, for slightly less weight...the Magpul CTR has done well for me.

I am a fan of KAC MICRO BUIS. They are phenomenal.

In case you haven't been there yet...here are more ideas for your upper: http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/AR-15-16-Recce-Upper-Groups-Mid-Length-s/132.htm

I would buy the complete lower (sans the stock...get what you want for that). Then throw a Gieselle in it, and you'll learn quite a bit right there about the internals. Keep the stock trigger as spare parts. The lower is rather simple...couple of detents, springs, pins.

I would buy a complete upper also, but that's just me. The market has become so commodotized that there is just not really much gain in DIY...other than the obvious "know how". If that's your game, then you shouldn't really be asking this question to begin with.

1-7 was made for 69 to 75 grain 5.56. 1-8 is better for a wider range of bullets. JP enterprises now only offer 1-8 that I have seen. Even the military is starting to use 1-8 in their dmr-spr set ups.

18 inches = better velocity and accuracy. Collapsing stock is more portable. I also have a colt non 16 inch barrel select fire m4( yeah I know it not techniquely a m4 but it's close)

I like the bcm products. Voltor is the upper I am planing on getting

Either the VIS or the MUR. Bcm offer a stainless barrel with a 1-8 twist with a voltor upper.

I have about 3\4 of cash saved for the gun... Time to start shopping!

EOtech or aimpoint.... Or a 1-4 scope???

Good deal man, keep us in the loop.

Question...for Recce...any reason you're going for a full length rail system (ie: vis / mur)?

I just received my first NSR from Noveske....it's phenomenal. Mine is only 9", which is what I wanted for my app...but a 13.5" (or 11") would be ideal for what you are wanting to build. Might be an option, if you're willing to buy a BCM stainless 16" upper (no forearm), buy an NSR separately, and have Ranier or ADCO install it for you on the BCM. You'll need a low profile gas block, but you can order that from Noveske when you order the NSR. Food for thought...they are light weight as hell.

I don't think I've mentioned this...but I also enjoy the Spike's Tactical ST-T2 buffers.

Recce spec includes a variable scope, if I recall correctly. Although, from that perspective, there is no official Recce spec...only a format, so to speak.

Depends on your intended use, GD. I have not done well "in the field" with the variable scopes. I don't like the eye relief challenges. I am a HUGE fan of the Aimpoint T-1...KAC or Larue mount (I use a Larue). Lightweight, Fast acquisition, Insane battery life, and robust as hell.

It's personal preference over the EOTech (you need to have fun behind both before deciding...find a gunshop, turn them on and play around with them....move fast around isles while keeping it in front of you....also, try setting it on an object and focusing on something far away outside 100-200 yd targets if possible). This will give you a feel for how you like the different reticles for CQB vs. Steady Range shots. I like simplicity...and the single red dot does it for me. The EOTech is too busy for my personal preference....but, that's just me. It's like Glocks vs 1911's. You need to try it.

i am trying to keep this rifle under $1500. i dont really undestand how to do what you are recomending. i am also trying to figure out how to buy the bcm lower. i have never done this before so itis all new to me.
if i get a aimpoint or eotech i will get the three power magnifire. i am disipointed in my leupold one point twofive by four power ar scope but thought that the night fource nxs or trijicon might work better. i didnt know youcould get the parts for the rifle and have a company build it for you as i said i am not sure how it works the daniel defence 12 inch light rail looks cool i will have to chec out the nsr rail.

new thought... bcm 410 stainless or cold hammer forged. the stainless has a 1-8 and the chf is 1-7. sounds like poeple are easly getting sub moa with either barrels.

i also saw that lmt offers their defender lower with a preinstalled two stage trigger and a amb selector. it also comes with a fde ergo grip and sopmod stock. they have the same lower kit with a sindle stage trigger that is a little cheaper. is there any advantge in having a two stage vs a single?

i have been doing soom research. i am trying to decide which to use. the bcm stainless barrel that is 16 inch with a mid length gas system or to go with the 18 inch and rifle lenght gas system. they both cost the same and the rail i want should cover the rifle and mid length gas block

man it seems all the part supply companies are sold out. they are not even taking back orders.

how does one go about ordering a lower from a company. i know that it requires a ffl. so do you ask around at local gun shops to see if they can order it?

You can have a gun shop order it if they're willing, or if they do ffl transfers you can get a signed copy of their ffl and order it yourself, but you have to have it shipped to the ffl holder. Just mail the signed copy of the ffl to the seller, easy peasy.

okay i guess i need to make some rounds to the local gun shops then. my first choice of a lower would be a LMT model. then if i cant get that one then maybe a spikes or BCM. thanks for the help SP.

i just found out somthing cool about the spikes lowers. they engrave three selector positions on all their lowers. even the semi auto ones. and they use bullet pictograms. so even the two positions lowers look full auto. they look sweet. they also have a lowe made for zombies. if you want a laugh check it out.

Funny. I used to own one of the zombie lowers, as well as one of the Jolly lowers (pirates)...the selector positions were something like "Parlee", "Arrggh", and "Plunder". Anyways, sold them and stayed with the more "low profile" lowers...no colors, no fancy engravings (except for one special engraving <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />)

Right. Find a local dealer that you like, and that doesn't charge a buttload for a transfer. I have one guy that I use repeatedly here in Austin...I won't change for anything. I like the small guys...it's more of a burden for the bigger shops.

Anyhow, find the one you like, and ask for a copy of his FFL so that you may place an order with LMT. LMT will request a copy of the FFL (you can scan and/or fax it to them) upon completion of your order. If you mail it, simply call them and tell them it's in the mail. Make SURE you include your invoice along with the FFL, so that they know who's order it belongs to. Easy.

Correction...apparently LMT will not let you do what I just said. However, this works with BCM, and most others.

Per LMT: http://www.lewismachine.net/

So, go here and find yourself a dealer in OH: http://www.lmtdefense.com/dealers.php?country=USA&state=OH

thanks for the info. i am trying to decide between the spikes enhanced lower or the lmt lower i like the lmtstock better but i like the bullet pictograms on the spikes. the lmt costs about $75 to $100 more than the spikes

If you're comparing "complete" lowers, this is not an apples to apples comparison.

The LMT comes with a SOPMOD stock, which is every bit worth the $200 pricetag. The Spikes come with Magpul CTR's, if I recall correctly....which yield a pricetag of about $95. So, make sure you're comparing these that you take that into account.

i havent had any problems with my magpul gear in the past. but i think the sopmod stock might bebetter for the recce build. the models i am looking at both have ambi selector switch. and two stage military triggers. i believe that the spikes is nickel boron coated though. i want the grip and stock to be FDE and both offer it. i cant be sure but i believe that both companies are out of stock though. i am not sure yet which one i will get but it could be which ever one is in stock first...... i dont want to wait forever. it sees bcm and brownells and other companies are out of stock with no idea of when the parts will be in stock again. So LMT or Spikes...... which one.....

BCM...nothing on the "lowers" page says "out of stock".

Fill this out, send in with MO + copy of FFL: http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/v/vspfiles/assets/images/bcm%20lrg%20order%20form.pdf

THEN, select whichever stock you want....SOPMOD, CTR, whatever. The SOPMOD is noticably heavier than the CTR...FYI only. I love my CTR's....if aiming for a truly lightweight rig, they are ideal.

iwill have to add a grip. stock. spikes buffer and a ambi selector though.

Correct..kindof.

BCM is $360 minus a stock body. Still comes with a standard grip and H-buffer, so you really only "need" need to poney up for a CTR, which at $95 or so, putting you around $450.

Spikes "basic" is $380, and you get the MOE grip (assuming you want it) and CTR stock (assuming you want it), and ST-T2. I pretty [censored] good deal, and if you were not aware, they get most of their internals from KNS (a really good machine shop).

Assuming that it fits your needs, the spikes is a heck of a deal. Maybe give Tom a call and ask when they expect them back in stock...give you a better feel for it.

I'm a whore, so I'd still get the BCM. My father had a heck of a time returning a piece of gear to Spikes. He's not the most PC guy, but they gave him the runaround and it took almost 60 days to get his credit back for something that was NOT his fault. They lost my "primary" business after that. Of course, I still buy their ST-T2 buffers from secondary suppliers (like BCM, lol) I still hear good things about them though...many happy customers.

okay thats interesting.... i HATE bad customer service... partof what got me going on busse kin knives is their great CS. i see that BCM carries the lmt sopmod and ergo grip. and the spikes buffer. well i guess i need to make a chose then.

have you used a bcm lower? are they a good product for the price.

I have two, and I love them.

Here's one of them in action. They never fail to go boom. I should mention that this one has a few upgrades, so not all internals are BCM. ST-T2, Giselle SSA, etc.

very nice!!!

is that an aim point

Yes, T-1

BTW...I wanted to say, I'm certain that Spike's is high quality gear. I wouldn't be afraid, except that I am, lol.

well if i get the bcm i get a funcioning lower i can upgrade at my own pace. i saw magpul has a stock called a STR that is along the same lines as a sopmod but has an A frame. any thoughts

Never held one, so hard to comment. I've read a little about them...but wouldn't want to comment on it without personal experience. The LMT is indestructable. I don't feel the same about my CTR's....but I chose the CTR as a lightweight component.

well i would take a magpul over a standard stock any day. have you heard anything about the B5 system sopmod stock. looks the same as the LMT to me minus the price tag.

Man the more i look the more i see that the Spikes lower kit is a great deal... did you ever have a problem with your spikes lowers other than bad customer service.

Looks can be deceiving. Think about what you're saying.

Other STEELS look as good, if not better than some of the Busse blades. However, are they worth the same? You and I both know the answer to this. Devil is in the details, brother.

I wouldn't be afraid of the Magpul...they make good kit. I know nothing of the SOPMOD knockoff. PERHAPS it is licensed from the same maker...but I would want 100% validation before purchasing.

and Spikes quality.... what is it like

Spikes makes good stuff. As I mentioned earlier, their internals (small parts...springs, pins, etc) are made by KNS Precision...very high quality stuff. If I had one, I wouldn't worry one minute about it....I'd shoot the heck out of it. First, I'd replace the trigger with a Gieselle though...but I've made that point enough times I think <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

how much does that trigger cost

150'ish. Google: Gieselle SSA

well i will add it down the road. i will start calling companies monday to ask about avalibility of the lowers i want.

Did you decide on a lower?

lmt with fde sopmod with ergo grip and ambi seletor. or spikes enhanced with fde gear or as a back up last ditch a plain BCM

my build is on hold intill i can find the parts i want some place in stock

I may be able to complete a build - hopefully by the end of the year


Parallax Tactical has a very nice upper for a quite reasonable price.


http://www.parallaxtactical.com/store/pxt-extreme-16-5-56-nato-complete-upper-416-ss-barrel-904.html


The page says sold out, but give them a call.

They may have a couple around.

This one is on my list of things to get. If I don't do this one, most likely a BCM upper.

I ordered a bcm cosmetic blem lower with internals. I'm out of state right now but will report on the condition when I get back later this week. It was $300 without the stock body. Took a week and a half to get it.

Here's an upper that I built. Vltor Upper, BCM stainless 1/8 mid length barrel, Centurion Rail, Battle comp, BCM bolt group. SWFA 1-4 illuminated scope. It is on a LMT lower. Softest shooting AR that I have, even softer than a rifle length AR.

very simimlar to what i want to build when i can get the parts.

I am not sure about the SPR, DMR, RECCE, or what the difference is to say which one mine is but I think I understand the concept. I recently put the finishing touches on what you describe above.

Specs:
-Spike's stripped lower
-lower internal parts from Brownells
-Giessele SSA Trigger (a must imo)
-Magpul 6 pos stock that locks, forget the name
-BCM bolt and bolt carrier group non chromed
-BCM stainless 16" medium contour mid length gas system upper with standard flash suppressor, Viking Tactics (Troy) cylindrical forend with bolt on rails
-Harris bipod on Larue quick detach so it mounts on a little rail
-Larue quick deatch scope mount
-Leupold 4-12 Mark AR scope
-Troy BUIS
-Surefire 6P light with Malcoff 220 lumen insert
-Viking tactics 2 point sling

I think that is everything. Right now it seems to shoot 69 gr. match the best. When you say 1 1/2 MOA with regular ammo, I think that will depend a lot on what regular is to you.

I did my homework and this was the best price/performance for me. My advise order parts from Brownells and backorder what is not available while you look elsewhere. Be put on BCM wait list for when their uppers and bolt carrier groups are available. I don't think things are going to be back in stock any time soon. Spike's and BCM make mil spec quality stuff at good prices imo. All my stuff is black becasue any other color is impossible to find and I am gonna paint it camo anyway.

What's the verdict?!

I don't have a non-blem lower to compare it to, but I honestly can't find a single thing wrong with it. Those BCM folks must have have some serious quality control standards to call this thing a cosmetic blem. Perfect fit with my new PSA upper. Rifle still not finished yet, though.

Dude, snap a quick WIP pic!!

Yeah, the blems I think are a logo or other feature mistake....not actual issue.

I'll take a pic when I get the energy, I'm laid up with a bug at the moment.

I knew it would function fine since they sell them as cosmetic blems, but I really can't find any issues with it cosmetic or otherwise.

Anyone had any experience with Delton?

Okay, here's a couple.

The rifle is a mock dissipator. The second pic shows that it has a mid length gas system with a rifle length sight radius. The front sight base functions as a front sight only.

It'll have OD green furniture when it's completed.

so how do you like the lower

It's great! Fully assembled BCM cosmetic blem lower for $300 without the stock body, $325 with the stock body. I can't find a defect anywhere! I plan on putting a rifle length stock on it so that's why I ordered it without the stock body, of course I also had to order a seperate buffer tube assembly because of this. I'm more than happy with it, but the trigger isn't the best.

bravo company has some of the parts i want in stock and now i am trying to get thefunds an gut to buy

looks like I'm on a list to get a stripped lower. have no idea what im going to build on it. thinking 9mm pistol with green furniture. or maybe a 300 aac hunting rifle. just don't know...

if you dont do 556 maybe 6.8spc. the 300aac looks cool but i have yet to see the ammo for it on a shelf some place.

i just seem to lean towards firearms in in the .300 caliber range. if somebody made a 10 round .357 upper i'd be all over it since i really would prefer not to add any more calibers to the what i already have. to get the hunting performance i would like i think .300 is a good option.

i'm actually leaning more toward 7.62x39 today. may be something different tomorrow but thinking it's maybe the strongest option because of price and availability of ammo. should be ordering the lower in the next few weeks. will be shopping for uppers...

well what about remingtons 30 AR. i heard its not bad.

never hear of Remington AR... you think it will be more popular than .300aac? jus a week or so Bass Pro here started stocking a .300aac AR15. I still think I may be leaning toward a x39. I'm not a huge fan of th ar15 platform but one good thing about them is you have plenty of options.

I've read that the 300AAC is much more reliable in the AR platform than the 7.62x39, also that its a great deer sized game cartridge.

Why not just get a mini thirty? Mines been great!

Yeah, the 7.62x39 is having issues.

That said....and I say this with regards to all of the specialty calibers....I have yet to meet a deer that didn't expire at the expense of a 62 grain TSX.

EDIT: Or a Hog for that matter...

that's what I thought I saw somewhere SP... was hoping that they had worked some of that out by now. thing is I have my m1a that I'm hoping its finally right. it's still a little bulky to me and the ammo is going to cost me. as much as I want performance I think I want something I can put a lot of round through and not break the bank. x39 would do that but aac probably not so much... which is why I was thinking x39z

i do almost wish I was okay with .223 but just prefer looking at .300 caliber ammo I guess. after watching a guy reloading .300aac im on the fence on which way to go. It looked simple enough and loading various .300 caliber ammo has been on my mind. Wouldn't be anytime soon but think the plan would be to load .9mm, .38, .357, .308 and another rifle caliber. Would probaly just buy x39 but I'm guessing reloading it would be an option if ever get there. I would more likely look into loading .300aac at some point if I went with that.

I also like 7.62x39, lazi. I bought a stainless mini thirty ten years ago its been a great rifle, very reliable. A little heavy with the wood stock, but I think I prefer wood on that rifle.

Lazi...what is it about 5.56 that doesn't do it for ya? Perception of lethality?

I'd argue it's more about the bullet selection, than the caliber. That, and knowing your ethical limitations regarding distance on targets.

Ishi...I can't wait to eradicate some hogs. My AR is still a couple of months away from being ready, though. Maybe I'll take some out with my 30-30 or S&W 29 in the meantime.

it's just my perception Ish. have no doubts that 5.56 is a very capable round. I love my fiveseven and it would be my go to handgun if things went crazy. and I'm acutally the same way with .400+ calibers. I have a nice short sub2000 .40 that should be fine with most .40 cal ammo. Even some of the hotter stuff but i still want a .357 lever action so I can shoot .357 and .38 special.

i really thought long and hard about a mini30. always comes back to "ahh...". I never remember what it is that shuts me down to the idea of one but it's always something.

i was thinking of doing to do a .357 lever action or .300 ar15 when a group buy came up for the AR lowers. I got my name on the list so now I'm making plans.

S&W makes an upper that shoots 300 Whisper and 300 AAC interchangeably.Gives you more options, might be worth taking a look at.

How about a link to that upper

man BC has a few of the parts i want in stock and the lmt store show they have a lower in stock.

i just dont have a CC to use.

Here it is:
http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/s...playErrorView_N

thanks SP. I am going to try to set up a CC account through my bank to start ordering parts.

You had said you have some of the money saved up already. If that money is in your bank you can have them issue you a check card, it works just like a credit card.

Although, a credit card is a good way to start building your credit. Just don't let it get away from you.

I would get the parts that don't stay in stock long first, like the assembled uppers. Lowers seem to stay in stock.

I have to set up the right account type checkcard/credit card. then I hope to start ordering parts. plus then my dad's CC will not have to be used to order from the Busse and kin.

many of the parts in stock now are what I want but not the color I want. but I can pant them and who knows when the other parts could come in.... tomorrow or six months after the election and everyone is trying to get stuff.

Is it something like a particular upper with a fore end in a certain color you're after? I was going to ceracote one the color I wanted until I got a deal on the upper I ended up getting.

Did you sign up for BCM's "email me when in stock"?

i did sign up. but nothing on the exact part i want. the parts for a upper that i want are not in stock
the bcm CHF barrel and DD m4socom rail are not in stock
the bcm stainless barrel with black finish with the DD light rail is not in stock
one just like the one above is in stock but the barrel is not black it is silver.

did some more looking and pretty sure I'm going to build a 7.62.39 ar15 at this point.

guessing there will be a lot of info for building these lowers once this group buy is done. may actually commit to learning this and plan for a second build once this one is done.

Keep us updated on your progress lazi.

well just read the group buy thread and it seems that the lowers may not ship until decemeber. was thinking about a rifle for when it cools down. smaller less expensive to shoot and equip than my m1a. so now thinking I may just piece up a complete lower with inexpensive x39 upper since I'm sold on the idea of this being the rifle to go with.

may just build a 9mm pistol on the lower when get it...



see this is why I didn't want to get into the AR platform... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

RRA has a sweet new 7.62-39 at that uses AK mags