From another thread:



Bob,


Hmmmm Lansky (and similar fixed angle jig systems) vs. mouse pad (and similar convex or strop type systems) are a little like vinegar and water to each other. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />


Some problems with Jigs vs. Stropping and/or belt sanders:

Jigs require constant angles.

Stropping and belt sanders create convex edges with inconsistent fluid curves.

The two don't mix well.

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You "can" convex edges that were at fixed angles pretty easily. But, then it requires a lot more work to get the edge back to the fixed angle because you will have to sharpen with the jig through the convex back to the jig's angle. That takes a lot of time and effort - unless you have some good coarse diamond stones. Again, quality and variety of stones help a lot, but also can cost a lot.

Same with stropping. You can strop a fixed angle blade, but it will convex the angle which takes that much more time and effort to get an angle back to a fixed angle.

Basically, for time and convenience sake, if you use a fixed angle jig, it is generally in your best interest to "maintain" that fixed angle. To do that, you really need to only use your jig because any efforts by hand on a free sitting stone, a strop or belt sander is just not going to maintain that angle.

Also, I personally use and like slightly different angles on different knives. I like my choppers to have a little thicker and stouter edge than my kitchen knives or folders or small slicers, etc. With a jig, you have to constantly change and set different angles. Again, for me, this was all just a hassle and jigs (for me) are just too darn slow and tedious.
With some practice, a belt sander is more about knowing some approximate angles, feel and similar. It might have a little steeper learning curve, but it quickly becomes so much faster and easier.


There is NOTHING wrong with sharpening jigs. But, if you like and want to use a jig, it seems to me you are best off “sticking” with a jig and not messing up your consistent angles by also using a strop type method….. unless you are experimenting with both systems on different knives and have certain knives set aside and dedicated to certain sharpening methods.... That would be learning! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" />

Jigs can all help you create RAZOR sharp edges. But, the jig is only a PART of the sharpening equation. Maintaining a constant fixed angle is what the jig helps you do. But, you have to set the angle and/or figure out a knives existing angle – which can be tricky. How and where a knife is mounted in the jig can change the angle a bit as well. Learning how to use your jig and set up all of these angles is a big part of becoming proficient with any jig. For me, that just became a hassle. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

Proper grit is another KEY part to sharpening with ANY system. And can be an expensive part – especially for certain jig systems.

While most stones probably last longer than most belts, the stones can cost MANY times more than comparable grit belts. In the end, along with being much faster and easier (IMO), I think a belt sander with belts is actually cheaper.

Keep in mind that many stones will actually hollow out over time which will affect the critical angles of a jigs intent - most noticable if changing from a hollowed out stone of one grit to a flat stone of another grit while trying to maintain the same angle. It won't work too well.

The Apex Pro is highly regarded sharpening jig/system. But, it is pretty expensive. And the stones that you have to buy for the system add up very fast – especially if you want a variety of grits.

If you are interested in a sharpening jig, I am confident, that the Lansky and Apex Pro are both effective. And you can learn a lot about edges by lots of use and familiarization with different sharpening techniques.

From the “Jigs” I have come across, I really liked the EZE Sharp Sharpening System (Jig)

See: Doing it EZE - posted by Trumby on Swamp Rat

The EZE Sharp was/is a heavy duty built jig. As far as jigs go, I think it was pretty versatile. Except, like other jigs, you have to have good quality stones. I was about to drop a lot more money on more stones for my EZE Sharp system....

But, then I started using my belt sander for sharpening. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />
I already had my belt sander prior to buying the EZE Sharp, but never considered using it for sharpening. I used it for shop/woodworking stuff. I saw where others used belt sanders on Knifeforums or somewhere... Maybe Jerry Hossom's post or something (????). I tried it and found how FAST it was. .... and how fast you could change an edge for the worse if you didn't understand and have a good technique. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

You can quickly appreciate the value of "Practicing" on cheap knives.

I only used my EZE system about 7-8 times before starting to use my belt sander. Then I shelved my EZE system. Eventually, someone contacted me to buy it. So, I sold it.


You can quickly spend lot more money on jigs and stones for the jigs than if you were to buy a decent belt sander, some good belts AND a leather strop with compounds.... even a bunch of cheapo knives for practicing on the belt sander can still cost less. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" />

Since they both require a different type of skill set for the most part to learn how to use properly, I don’t think I would say that using and getting familiar with one system will help so much with another.

But, maybe you want to master a variety of sharpening techniques/methods.... And be a "Connoisseur" of sharpening.

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In regards to your inquiry about: you spotted “one” at JRE (??????),.... you had been discussing Lansky and homemade mouse-pad system. Most mouse-pad systems use sandpaper and can work very well. But, I think the mouse-pad systems inevitably lead to a leather strop – which JRE sells a very functional strop bat that I assume you were referring to.

Like this: JRE Industries - Strop Bats

I don’t have one of JRE’s strop bats. But, I have dealt with Dan at JRE. He seemed very helpful and friendly to deal with to me. And I have seen some posts in regards to others saying JRE’s strop belt was well made and a good design.

JRE’s price of $35 for a 4-sided and pre-loaded strop bat with (I am sure) good quality strop leather on a Red Oak bat, seems like a VERY good price/deal.

Notice JRE states: “We can make The Strop Bat any size you like. Custom size Strop Bats are NOT a problem! Just call us or email us with your specifications.”

Personally, I like a little larger strop bat. My strops leather surface area is about 13" x 3.1875" – But, mine is probably larger than needed.
I still like a surface area larger than 1.5" width as it helps with larger knives (IMO). But, in all fairness, you could easily strop a 10” blade on the “9 - 10 Inches long by 1.5 inches wide” like the strop surface area of JRE’s strop. The length is definitely not a problem.
But, personally, I would probably still opt up to a 2.5” wide strop or at least 2” wide which would still be plenty good and better/more versatile than 1.2" wide.
I don’t think most people would appreciate much gain in going up to 3” wide over 2.5” width. But, I think 2" has some advantages over 1.5" and 2.5" has some advantages over 2.0".
I don’t know what Dan charges for the custom sizing. But, I am pretty sure the prices would be fair and reasonable.

I ordered a sheath for my Bravo 1 from JRE that is nowhere near as nice as some of Jeff’s (Rainwalker) sheaths. I would rather own one of Jeff’s sheaths, but this was a time crunch situation and the JRE sheath was inexpensive, very functional and good quality for the money. He actually didn’t have the sheath in stock, but he made it up the night I ordered it and I had the sheath like 2-3 days later – VERY fast. I don’t believe that type of speed is normal – especially for out of stock items, but if anything, I would say that Dan at JRE obviously tries to work with his customers to help them get what they want.

For the record, convex sharpening by hand on a strop is still slow and tedious - especially if significant reprofiling is needed. But, the great thing about having a manual (convex technique )strop is for touching up. A strop bat is a great compliment to a belt sanding technique. - *One doesn't mess up the other.

With the right belts on a belt sander, you can get a VERY fine hair splitting edge and have no "need" for a strop. But, having and knowing how to use the strop for touch ups can be good for those times when you don't want to go outside, into your garage/shop, etc. to crank up the belt sander.... even if it would still be way faster to go to the shop/garage and use the belt sander.

Sometimes I will strop a knife or two while watching TV or something. But, also, some people might want a portable "field" strop kit. - something that would mess up fixed angle jig sharpened edges.


For some other tips, I want to defer to a whole "Sub"-Forum on Knifeforums.com See: Knifeforums - "Keeping Sharp" Forum

There is a LOT more info there. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbup.gif" alt="" />

But, be advised, including myself and my own opinions, you will find others who are quite set and confident with their own opinions and experiences.

Many people, including myself, have spent a lot of money investing into different sharpening systems before settling on our preferred methods. Some people prefer jigs (?????) – my guess is those people may have tried a LOT of systems,..... but “PROBABLY” did not try using a power belt sander with decent belts, decent abrasives and strops. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

In all fairness though, some people might still prefer a manual jig or just strop system because they can't get the hang of a powered system or might just be afraid of hurting themselves or their knives with a powered system. I can't say that any given system is wrong for any reason. They are just different. And I just happen to like the speed of a powered system and I prefer my end results as well.... But, that is me. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

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